Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

mcipetition.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 90 posts

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#21

Post by siren2026 »

ianm218 wrote: post #13
foltik wrote: post #6

It’s a bit hard to feel sympathetic here. Those signing this petition actively enable and profit from one of the most pervasive surveillance networks ever built. Funny how much easier it is to tolerate something when it only affects other people.

I find Metas work very unethical but me but I think they should have basic workers rights still. Like yes what Meta is doing is legal and it’s at will work, but this level of surveillance feels like something the law didn’t really anticipate.

> I think they should have basic workers rights still

You make it look like they are underpaid poor manual workers.

Those are people that chose to make >500k$/year by joining a company that is known to be one of the most toxic tech companies. Mos tof those people had probably multiple offers ad decided to optimize for money besides anything else. I have a hard time to feel sympathy or petition for their "worker's rights"

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#23

Post by dylan604 »

cyanydeez wrote: post #8
foltik wrote: post #6

It’s a bit hard to feel sympathetic here. Those signing this petition actively enable and profit from one of the most pervasive surveillance networks ever built. Funny how much easier it is to tolerate something when it only affects other people.

[flagged]

Did you honestly just compare getting paid large six figure salaries in comfy workspaces with spoiled children like perks to slavery and expect people to accept your premise? You look foolish if you're joking and you're a fool if you're serious. Either way, not a good look

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#25

Post by dylan604 »

btbuildem wrote: post #17

Petition? What do you think this is, a democracy? All* corporations are dictatorships, and you're disposable machinery in one. Irony is off the charts here, given what you helped build. *not Mondragon, but like, pretty much all.

What does a petition have to do with democracy? They are not suggesting putting it to a vote. They have a grievance with authority and are attempting to show how widespread that grievance is with signatures of those aggrieved.

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#26

Post by tibbar »

siren2026 wrote: post #21
ianm218 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find Metas work very unethical but me but I think they should have basic workers rights still. Like yes what Meta is doing is legal and it’s at will work, but this level of surveillance feels like something the law didn’t really anticipate.

> I think they should have basic workers rights still You make it look like they are underpaid poor manual workers. Those are people that chose to make >500k$/year by joining a company that is known to be one of the most toxic tech companies. Mos tof those people had probably multiple offers ad decided to optimize for money besides anything else. I have a hard time to feel sympathy or petition for their "worker's rig…

This feels overly cynical. My long-time friend took a job at Meta (over equally compelling financial alternatives) because the manager pitched the team and growth prospects well. (Meta turned out to be quite disappointing on these fronts. I never heard money as an important factor for joining or for leaving.)

In general, the kind of people who get an offer from any particular big tech company probably can get similar money elsewhere, so it's unlikely to be as big a factor as you suggest.

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#27

Post by tdeck »

People who are focusing on whether we should have sympathy for Meta employees here are missing the point.

Meta employees have some of the strongest bargaining power in our industry. This particular imposition is undesirable to almost everyone. There is no upside in it for employees.

Therefore, if Meta employees can be forced to accept it, everyone will be. And you'd better believe that there will be a flood of companies happy to set this up for your employer at your workplace.

That's why, as someone who wouldn't consider working at Meta for ethical reasons, I'm hoping this pushback succeeds. A win for Meta here throws the floodgates wide open. A loss helps put the brakes on a bit.

Furthermore, collective action that starts like this (and keeps pressure up) is much more effective than a bunch of individuals quitting their jobs. That's why employers would much prefer the latter when they're up to no good.

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#28

Post by tdeck »

dylan604 wrote: post #25
btbuildem wrote: post #17

Petition? What do you think this is, a democracy? All* corporations are dictatorships, and you're disposable machinery in one. Irony is off the charts here, given what you helped build. *not Mondragon, but like, pretty much all.

What does a petition have to do with democracy? They are not suggesting putting it to a vote. They have a grievance with authority and are attempting to show how widespread that grievance is with signatures of those aggrieved.

Also historically something like a petition seems to always be the first step in any kind of pressure campaign. It's a relatively low stakes (but not completely risk free) way to count support.

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#29

Post by dccoolgai »

phyzome wrote: post #22

Try unionizing rather than just asking nicely.

It's so hard to do that but it's really the only way. I had this idea that tech companies should organize _each others_ unions. Like Google employees should organize Meta's union and visa versa so no one is "sacrificing their career" by doing it.

Re: Petition against Meta's employee training data collection for ML models

#30

Post by tdeck »

supertroop wrote: post #4

If I was Mark my answer would be “or what?” These people already work at a vile company. Which means they sold out already. If what mark does to other people doesn’t bother them they probably won’t have the backbone to leave if he says pound sand. “Oh it’s ok if you do it to other people just not me.” Get bent.

If this is what you get for selling out, just imagine what those of us who didn't sell out can expect? People sell out in order to get better conditions for themselves. Furthermore, this monitoring only strengthens Meta's ability to effectively surveil the rest of us.
Post reply on HN