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Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

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Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#51

Post by imhoguy »

ansk wrote: post #3

I've found breathing exercises to be effective for the duration of the exercise, but I'm more interested in the possibility of training myself to adjust my respiration patterns over sustained durations. Would it be beneficial -- or even possible at all -- to adjust my body's default/subconscious breathing patterns to match those mentioned in the article? Tangentially related, are there any wearable devices that allow…

Anectata, but I found that active wearables can help with initial motivation, but long term they become chore or even stressful when forced. I use them only for passive long trends tracking.

Our brains trick us to breath on defaults adjusted to our surroundings.

What I have found working to slow down breath is:

1st willful exercise repetition,

2nd changing surrounding environment and lifestyle (nature, decluttwring, idleness, peaceful eating, proper sleep)

3rd gaining awareness about trigger mechanisms (overcommitments, overexpectations)

It is all self-regulating. And pretty much what mindfulnes, meditation, prayer or forest walk brings.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#52

Post by adrian_b »

tmach32 wrote: post #43

I've been practicing coherent breathing (6 breaths/min, equal inhalation and exhalation) to help with anxiety. I'm mostly going off a study[1] where participants who practiced coherent breathing 20 mins a day reported significantly improved outcomes weeks later. Does anyone have advice about HRV specifically within the context of anxiety? I've been measuring my SDNN using a Polar strap, and it hasn't really budged. H…

As demonstrated in an older article cited in the parent article, at the same pace of 6 breaths/min it matters a lot which is the ratio between the exhalation time and the inhalation time.

In the experiments, slow inhalation with fast exhalation was never helpful, equal inhalation and exhalation was helpful only in certain circumstances and fast inhalation with slow exhalation (i.e. 2-second inhalation followed by 8-second exhalation) was always efficient in stimulating the parasympathetic nervous system and inhibiting the sympathetic nervous system.

The results from TFA are specifically for fast inhalation and slow exhalation, not for slow breathing in general.

The negative results from the article linked by you are perfectly consistent with the other results, which showed that equal inhalation and exhalation was useful only in certain circumstances, which were not tested in the article linked by you.

In general, slow breathing by fast inhalation and slow exhalation (or any other kind of slow breathing) does not have effects when you are already relaxed and having nothing to worry about, but only when you are stressed, either by anticipating that something bad will happen or while something bad is actually happening.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#53

Post by brador »

achow wrote: post #39
Sam6late wrote: post #17

Slow breathing is also recommended for novices before public speaking, as it helps speakers overcome irrational physiological fear of facing people, the risk-taking shift is useful as it helps you speak more confidently, not more cautiously. Slow breathing can calm nerves quickly; bottom-up regulation: body tells brain “you’re safe”.

Slow breathing (in yoga: pranayama) instantly down-regulates your nervous system by boosting vagal tone and lowering sympathetic "fight-or-flight" activity. When your breath lengthens, it signals your brain that you are completely safe, dropping your heart rate and lowering blood pressure. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12858147/

It doesn’t signal anything. Your heart rate drops because you’re inhaling less oxygen so your heart is like “we don’t need this high fi flow” and slows down blood flow to lower energy expenditure.

Lower energy state always wins unless chasing energy source.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#54

Post by watwut »

thisoneisreal wrote: post #8
cryzinger wrote: post #4

Parasympathetic nervous activation increased risk-taking behavior? That's interesting/unexpected (at least to me). Also, this part caught my eye: > The selective impact of prolonged exhalation breathing on reward responsiveness has important implications for clinical contexts, such as anxiety, panic disorder, and depression, given their distinct autonomic signatures and maladaptive reward processing. By enhancing car…

I agree it's counterintuitive, but it makes sense when I think about how, for example, it's the least neurotic people who do high-risk activities like base jumping or mountain climbing. Fear drives you away from threatening things, lack of fear allows you to move toward them more comfortably.

I dont know what you mean by "neurotic", but my impression was that quite a lot of these have mental health issues. In some cases, the risk taking seemed more like hope for suicide in denial. And they tend to be difficult people with broken relationship.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#55

Post by setopt »

brador wrote: post #53
achow wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slow breathing (in yoga: pranayama) instantly down-regulates your nervous system by boosting vagal tone and lowering sympathetic "fight-or-flight" activity. When your breath lengthens, it signals your brain that you are completely safe, dropping your heart rate and lowering blood pressure. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12858147/

It doesn’t signal anything. Your heart rate drops because you’re inhaling less oxygen so your heart is like “we don’t need this high fi flow” and slows down blood flow to lower energy expenditure. Lower energy state always wins unless chasing energy source.

Note that fast breathing doesn’t necessarily mean high oxygen uptake. Deep breaths result in higher oxygen uptake (since you spend less time just moving the same stale air up and down your airways), and deep breaths are usually easier to perform when breathing slowly.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#58

Post by t-3 »

toxik wrote: post #46
gorgoiler wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favourite of these is. “If you feel jealous, talk about it, then we’ll figure something out” In which one of the children wants the other one’s cool toy so the parent’s response is to encourage them to ask for it to be shared. Except they aren’t siblings and it’s the mom from the other family teaching their own jealous kid to go ask. How about this?: Back off cat family, you fair weather commies — that’s Daniel’s…

I mean Daniel Tiger in general just makes me cringe, it's just so extremely American. Absolutely zero stakes, all problems are resolved perfectly within literal seconds. Nothing is left "unfinished", never dares to leave the conflict unresolved for any meaningful amount of time. It's just such a stark contrast to, say, Peppa Pig, where the message is basically always some form of "shit is going to happen, find ways t…

I agree with the "extremely American", but the not getting upset is just also an extremely American adoption of elite mannerisms at all levels of society. Publically showing emotion is considered vulgar and low-class in many cultures.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#59

Post by neonstatic »

meindnoch wrote: post #44
Sam6late wrote: post #17

Slow breathing is also recommended for novices before public speaking, as it helps speakers overcome irrational physiological fear of facing people, the risk-taking shift is useful as it helps you speak more confidently, not more cautiously. Slow breathing can calm nerves quickly; bottom-up regulation: body tells brain “you’re safe”.

Professional public speakers use a beta blocker like propanolol before going on stage.

That's just sad.

Re: Slow breathing modulates brain function and risk behavior

#60

Post by PaulHoule »

elendilm wrote: post #57

The idiocy of thinking calmness leading to optimal results. Usually this comes from people who never accomplished anything. The paper is the prime example of pseudo science masquerading as science.

It’s got to be U shaped. There is a reason you have a sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system.
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