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Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

reuters.com

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Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#21

Post by JumpCrisscross »

newfriend wrote: post #15
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's used for feedback and as a patient tutor it would accelerate their learning? We have mounting evidence AI hurts learning and cognition in many circumstances. I have not yet seen similar-quality evidence for it helping. Given that balance, restricting AI in education in the general population (while studying how to best deploy it) seems prudent. Especially given the Norwegian approach, which gradually introduce…

Do you delegate all opinions to only those which have studies?

> Do you delegate all opinions to only those which have studies?

For policy decisions around something like education standards, something for which we have an established status quo (which works in Norway)? Yes. I don’t think waiting for evidence to act is imprudent in that situation.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#22

Post by wwweston »

jenthoven wrote: post #2

Surprised to read this as Norway also has Sikt AI for schools, where teachers can monitor how AI systems are used. Seems like it has both embraced AI and banned it.

I wonder if the struggle is really comprehending thoughtful selective adoption.

Schools are the place where the product is a more fully developed person. There's no LLM shortcut for generating that. There are many ways you could use LLMs that would discourage it. There may be some that can encourage it.

Personally, I can see aggressively keeping kids away from LLMs until they've learned effort, living in tension/frustration, the pleasure of breaking through to discovery, trust evaluation, hypothesis/test cycles, and good socratic dialogue from the learner's side.

It may be possible at intermediate phases to prime some models to help with this process.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#23

Post by forgetfreeman »

baq wrote: post #14

AI used to write homework should be banned. AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware (live scanning pen and paper), harness and guardrails should be wildly successful (in terms of education outcomes) especially in elementary school.

We thought the same of electronic devices in general and digital learning content specifically. In actual practice both result in lowered test scores and declining critical thinking skills.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#24

Post by [deleted] »

bko wrote: post #13

Im confused, are there tasks given to 6 to 13 year old to use AI? In the classroom, are they just throwing gpt in front of them? Is that the modern equivalent of watching a vhs? Or do they have homework to vibe code something or given some prompts to ask at home and save somewhere? Serious question, what does this mean?

[deleted]

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#25

Post by baq »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #17
baq wrote: post #14

AI used to write homework should be banned. AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware (live scanning pen and paper), harness and guardrails should be wildly successful (in terms of education outcomes) especially in elementary school.

> AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware, harness and guardrails should be wildly successful I’m open to the idea! Show me the evidence. Then we can roll it out to our kids.

Glad you’re asking. https://cepr.org/publications/dp21577

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#27

Post by tadfisher »

replwoacause wrote: post #10

Good, wholeheartedly agree with this. Too bad US legislators are impotent.

US legislators have almost no say in how schools are run. The DoE is a husk, and states call the shots. In my state of Oregon, you will have wildly different curricula and standards depending on your district, because there's almost no state oversight either.

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#28

Post by YawningAngel »

baq wrote: post #25
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware, harness and guardrails should be wildly successful I’m open to the idea! Show me the evidence. Then we can roll it out to our kids.

Glad you’re asking. https://cepr.org/publications/dp21577

>AI users who maintain similar homework completion time as non-AI users experience small learning losses.

Seems like there's no benefit even if it's used "correctly"?

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#29

Post by JumpCrisscross »

baq wrote: post #25
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI in 1:1 tutor mode with proper hardware, harness and guardrails should be wildly successful I’m open to the idea! Show me the evidence. Then we can roll it out to our kids.

Glad you’re asking. https://cepr.org/publications/dp21577

“AI adoption raises homework scores by 18% and reduces completion time by 30%, but lowers monthly exam scores by 20% within six months. High-stakes entrance-exam scores fall by 18 and 24%, with the full penalty emerging only after about two years.”

Yup. Short-term metrics juice. Actual comprehension and cognition falls. This seems to be the case across the board, including with adults.

I’m genuinely optimistic that there is a way to make AI helpful in education. I just don’t think we’ve found it yet. (We certainly haven’t demonstrated it.)

Re: Norway imposes near ban on AI in elementary school

#30

Post by vorticalbox »

bko wrote: post #13

Im confused, are there tasks given to 6 to 13 year old to use AI? In the classroom, are they just throwing gpt in front of them? Is that the modern equivalent of watching a vhs? Or do they have homework to vibe code something or given some prompts to ask at home and save somewhere? Serious question, what does this mean?

Well one can no longer search for information in the big search engines without it just giving you the answer.

This ruins “search and topic and write about it”

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