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Leave a Trace

jakeworth.com

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Re: Leave a Trace

#51

Post by DevDesmond »

jongjong wrote: post #19

Leaving a trace is something I've been grappling with which seemed incredibly straight forward initially as an open source developer. These days, I find myself questioning for whom am I leaving a trace for? What kinds of humans or entities? Do I care about the kinds of entities who will inhabit the future? Or will their value system be so different to my own that I'd prefer not to have anything to do with them. Beyon…

I actually use this line of reasoning to motivate and inspire some of my own art and cultural artifacts. When a far future galactic civilization pauses to ask, “who are we and where did we come from“, they might just look back at the ledger of humanity’s written outputs. In this sense, the entire trace we manage to save to disk could be viewed as a body of work were any of it to survive. Even pieces of work that nobody reads today could have a long line of future audiences and help shape the galaxy’s understanding of its cultural heritage. (These future entities might have far more processing power and bandwidth to spend on the analysis of our work).

Re: Leave a Trace

#52

Post by jongjong »

swiftcoder wrote: post #30
jongjong wrote: post #19

Leaving a trace is something I've been grappling with which seemed incredibly straight forward initially as an open source developer. These days, I find myself questioning for whom am I leaving a trace for? What kinds of humans or entities? Do I care about the kinds of entities who will inhabit the future? Or will their value system be so different to my own that I'd prefer not to have anything to do with them. Beyon…

In the context the article intends, the trace isn't really for you, it's for the people you interact with

I don't believe in that definition of altruism.

To me, true altruism is selfish. If helping people makes you feel good, then you're an altruist.

If helping others doesn't make you feel good innately but you do it all for others then I think there is some self-deception at play. Maybe it's a status or self-image thing? Because being an altruist is higher status and you want to see yourself as high status? I think you can always trace it back to a selfish motive at some level.

Denying the selfish root of altruism can lead to hypocrisy because there is a dissonance between who the individual really is in their natural state and who they want to believe themselves to be. They have to constantly work to be who they aspire to be; it's not second nature to them and they will frequently fall short whenever it slips their mind or when they occasionally give in to natural impulses. Good on them for trying I guess. Better than not trying at all. But they're not an altruist.

I believe Richard Dawkins' "The Selfish Gene" backs me up on this point. Altruism is a either a kin-selection process or a reciprocal (transactional) process.

Re: Leave a Trace

#53

Post by boothby »

randusername wrote: post #23

Similar idea: don't go through life anonymously. Go to your professor's office hours, learn the names of your neighbors, become a regular at the local sandwich shop and shoot the breeze with staff, ask the people you're waiting in line alongside if they have any good jokes. Don't be fooled that social media and conspicuous consumption are the best paths to community.

If you're going to strike up conversation with strangers, it's best if you make it easy for them. If you're asking for a joke, you're making it easy on yourself and setting a bar for them. I'm a jokester but I don't have a good repertoire of jokes on hand -- I respond to banter. So if you ask me if I have a joke, I often just sputter and throw out the last bad pun somebody shared with me.

Make a joke yourself, if you're feeling funny. But be warned... a stranger once asked me why I was going on a trip. I was visiting my dad who was presently in surgery for cancer that would go on to end his life. I was too emotional to answer with anything but the truth. I certainly wasn't going to respond well to humor.

Re: Leave a Trace

#54

Post by forshaper »

jagenabler2 wrote: post #43
jasonpeacock wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That all sounds exhausting (introvert here). The last thing I want to do when out in public is be stuck talking with strangers.

The price of community is inconvenience

The price of a strong community is extreme annoyance (and it's worth every bit of frustration)

Re: Leave a Trace

#56

Post by SoftTalker »

boothby wrote: post #53
randusername wrote: post #23

Similar idea: don't go through life anonymously. Go to your professor's office hours, learn the names of your neighbors, become a regular at the local sandwich shop and shoot the breeze with staff, ask the people you're waiting in line alongside if they have any good jokes. Don't be fooled that social media and conspicuous consumption are the best paths to community.

If you're going to strike up conversation with strangers, it's best if you make it easy for them . If you're asking for a joke, you're making it easy on yourself and setting a bar for them. I'm a jokester but I don't have a good repertoire of jokes on hand -- I respond to banter. So if you ask me if I have a joke, I often just sputter and throw out the last bad pun somebody shared with me. Make a joke yourself, if yo…

> I was visiting my dad who was presently in surgery for cancer

This is the risk of striking up conversations with strangers. You have no idea what their mood, concerns, or troubles might be. So please be prepared for a less-than-pleasant subject to talk about if you insist on intruding on someone else's thoughts.

Re: Leave a Trace

#57

Post by lukan »

jasonpeacock wrote: post #26
randusername wrote: post #23

Similar idea: don't go through life anonymously. Go to your professor's office hours, learn the names of your neighbors, become a regular at the local sandwich shop and shoot the breeze with staff, ask the people you're waiting in line alongside if they have any good jokes. Don't be fooled that social media and conspicuous consumption are the best paths to community.

That all sounds exhausting (introvert here). The last thing I want to do when out in public is be stuck talking with strangers.

"is be stuck talking with strangers."

Then learn not just how to start, but also how to end a conversation. I hated having to do small talk with people - until I learned that I had not to. I now can share something interesting - and then go back to minding my buisness. (If the other person is deaf on their end - strong signals to end a conversation are looking away, turning the body away, opening up ones laptop ... (or put out the damn phone) or put on earphones)

Re: Leave a Trace

#58

Post by SoftTalker »

knorker wrote: post #31
jasonpeacock wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That all sounds exhausting (introvert here). The last thing I want to do when out in public is be stuck talking with strangers.

As a fellow introvert, I would recommend that you see it as taking medication. Or getting exercise. You don't do it because you like it. You do it because if you don't, then you'll be worse off years later.

You say this as if introversion is something to be "cured."

It's like telling a gay man that he just needs to try dating more women.

There's nothing wrong with being an introvert. It's not really a choice in the first place.

Re: Leave a Trace

#59

Post by lukan »

jader201 wrote: post #40
knorker wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fellow introvert, I would recommend that you see it as taking medication. Or getting exercise. You don't do it because you like it. You do it because if you don't, then you'll be worse off years later.

> You do it because if you don't, then you'll be worse off years later. This feels hyperbolic. While I would agree that community and remaining connected are very important to overall health, I don’t feel like making a habit of talking to strangers is a prerequisite.

"I don’t feel like making a habit of talking to strangers is a prerequisite."

But if you practise that skill, you will then also be able to pick up a conversation with people you do find interesting.

Re: Leave a Trace

#60

Post by optikaluzion »

randusername wrote: post #23

Similar idea: don't go through life anonymously. Go to your professor's office hours, learn the names of your neighbors, become a regular at the local sandwich shop and shoot the breeze with staff, ask the people you're waiting in line alongside if they have any good jokes. Don't be fooled that social media and conspicuous consumption are the best paths to community.

This is great advice.

Although, the hardest part for me is the interaction with the neighbors, simply because it's not an easy relationship to sever if things go sideways. Still good to know the name of the crazy neighbor, I suppose.

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