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Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

paulkrugman.substack.com

71–80 of 115 posts

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#71

So, what he says is that productivity gains in the U.S. are: 1. Only apparent when measured at 2017 prices but not when measured at PPP (purchase power). 2. In the US most of productivity gains are concentrated at the tech industry and California. The rest of the economy (and most of non-California states) are less productive than Europe. Personally, I am not entirely convinced but these are interesting arguments. It…

US healthcare is extremely productive. It is also quite expensive.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#72
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is really no similary between the most populous areas of Europe and, say, Columbus or Chicago or .... The summers in eastern America are savage and inhuman; the winters, by contrast, are ... savage and inhuman. People complain about the weather in England, but in fact there are palm and eucalyptus growing in Oxford, though it's bad taste and you might lose one in a bad winter. It never gets hot and never gets c…

So despite a nicer climate more people die of heat in Europe than the US which just makes Europe look a lot worse.

either that or the U.S doesn't consider the same data when making its stats

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/u-s-deaths-from-h...

Where two sets of stats are concerned always make sure they actually are using the same criteria for reporting.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#73
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Multinationals really confuse comparisons Well, yes, but in both cases of Youtube revenue and Apple, that money is eventually going to show up in the accounts of the US parent company and its share price, even if it's in a Swiss bank account. It's very hard to say where internet economic productivity ""is""! That might cause it to be over- or under- counted.

Multinationals are disincentivized to send revenue back to the USA because they are taxed twice on it - they're taxed in the country it was earned in and they're taxed again in the USA as income because they are essentially completely different companies. Trump had a tax holiday in his first term where companies were allowed to send revenue back to the USA without being taxed. If I remember correctly apple sentt back…

Money usually stays in the community where it is paid. Even within the US, local businesses keep something like 80% of the money local in the community (spent at other local businesses or banks, city taxes, etc.), meanwhile buying from a chain store has most of the money shipped to some tax haven in Texas or Arkansas.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It might make life more comfortable during some days of heatwaves but it's definitely not a need to survive. Well I don't know , I lived 4 years in the Netherlands in one of those apartments that have huge windows on every room. During the summer some days got closed to 37-38c and the sun sets at what , 11PM ? I was pretty scared our newborn might die - I put a fan right on her of course but I'm not sure this setup…

the sun sets at what , 11PM ? No. Even now, in the longest days of the year, the sun sets at 10pm, and we're not even into the hottest days of the year for another month or two as the days continue to get shorter again.

Yeah 10PM is still really bad, the house becomes a freaking oven

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#75

The apologetism of American socioeconomic system is a thing endemic to HN. Even Reddit with its USA-skewed demographic is far less delusional, for all its other faults. Same for other social media like YT. I suppose it's a distinction of well-to-do SWEs (and VCs alike) vs actual working class majority.

They are also weirdly pro-Israel and pro-surveillance (see any stories about Palantir or Palestine get flagged within minutes).

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#76
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So despite a nicer climate more people die of heat in Europe than the US which just makes Europe look a lot worse.

either that or the U.S doesn't consider the same data when making its stats https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/u-s-deaths-from-h... Where two sets of stats are concerned always make sure they actually are using the same criteria for reporting.

I am using the adjusted numbers. Official are 2k and scientist adjusted are around 12k. WHO's estimate for Europe is 175k. I do find all the European justification here to show a lot about what Europeans actually think of their own citizens. The numbers make us look bad and so the numbers must be wrong because we can never look bad in this way is such a modern American leadership way of looking at it.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#77

It's difficult to consider Krugman's takes seriously after his very flawed 1998 predictions. Perhaps he's uniquely poorly suited to understanding the role of technology in economic development, and is best described as an economist with a very limited outlook outside his narrow discipline? https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/paul-krugman-internets-eff...

I've never heard of this guy before, but this is extremely petty. Are you suggesting you've never been wrong in your life? Do you think it would be interesting if, rather than engaging with anything you said, people dragged out a quote from 28 years ago to dismiss everything you say? This is an embarrassingly low form of ad hominem.

He's basically repeating his mistake - underestimating the relevance of technological progress - from 28 years ago, except now it's explicitly in service of his political bias.

For your information: Paul Krugman is a Nobel memorial prize winning economist. He used the publicity of his award to become, essentially, a political commentator, including an opinion column in the most important American newspaper of record, the New York Times. He's not a random commenter on a website, without any ambitions of relevance. He uses the aura of being an eminent scientist to give his personal opinions a veneer of respectability that they perhaps do not merit.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#78
I work in the energy sector for a manufacturer you’ve definitely heard of.

The USA is ahead in certain industries, mostly information technology, but decades behind in others.

Literally, you have technology most of Europe moved away from in the 80s(air insulated HV switchgear), where most of Europe now mostly builds gas insulated switchgear.

Europa has a GDP on par with the USA. Honestly what do people think the product is, wine and cheese?

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the sun sets at what , 11PM ? No. Even now, in the longest days of the year, the sun sets at 10pm, and we're not even into the hottest days of the year for another month or two as the days continue to get shorter again.

Yeah 10PM is still really bad, the house becomes a freaking oven

The numbers you cite are from last year, which was unusual historically as records, not the norm. The sunset in the hottest month will be 9pm, and those highs of >30C are experienced for less than one week. I think you're missing the point of the parent posters where it's over 25C in the large parts of the US for 3-4 months of the year.

Re: Challenging the Narrative of European Decline

#80
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't buy into this critique at all... I live in two cities in Europe. I like our size of houses. I like not needing to own a car. I like that in both of the cities I live in there are 8 supermarkets within ten minutes walk. I like that I never have to think about healthcare costs. I've never felt the need for air conditioning. And when I see Americans' lives, they seem full of crappy stuff that I have no need for,…

I think it's valid to question whether and how GDP translates into happiness, but America (as a whole) does just have .. more and bigger. We will eventually start cottoning on to air conditioning as people realize it's a bidirectional solution that can warm you in the winter. The need is genuinely less than the US as Europe is both further north (New York is the same latitude as Lisbon) and currently benefiting from…

I don't have AC so by the above measurement I'm poor. But I have a heat pump which circulates chilled water through the floors. So which way should we compare now?
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