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GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

discuss.grapheneos.org

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Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#281

Post by 4gotunameagain »

bigiain wrote: post #248

I have two questions, if anyone has any advice. 1) What's a reasonable Pixel phone to buy to try out GrapheneOS? Is a 128GB Pixel 7 "good enough" or will I get a significantly better experience with a newer phone and/or more storage? 2) Is there a Graphene alternative that would let me de-google an Samsung A12? Back in the day I had some Galaxy S3 and S4 phones that I installed Lineage on, I have no idea if that's co…

If you want to try it out, you can easily buy an 8a for like 250 euros used. 128GB is certainly good enough, unless you plan on migrating your mp3 library to it or you take a lot of videos. My only qualms is the lack of SD card, for the aforementioned mp3s.

And trust me you'll like it ;)

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#282

Post by ebbi »

Cider9986 wrote: post #182
ebbi wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much flexibility is there in changing appearance? As an iPhone user, I really like what Oppo is doing with their ColorOS: https://www.oppo.com/nz/coloros16/

Wow that looks nice. I don't think you can get that. You can change any apps to different apps meaning the keyboard, homescreen/launcher, messaging app. The launcher is a primary UI thing which is different from iOS and is totally customizable by just installing a new app. So you can change the look of anything that depends on an app, but stuff like the control center, lock screen, volume sliders, connectivity icons,…

Thanks! I've been contemplating trying out Graphene, but I really enjoy the user experience of iOS. But I feel like I should at least get acquainted with Graphene as the inevitable enshittification of iOS will occur.

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#283

Post by dns_snek »

Cider9986 wrote: post #231
edwcross wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it affect the photo quality? It used to require letting go of the default photo app and thus a downgrade in photo processing.

No, if you install the Google camera there is no difference in quality and by revoking network you don't lose privacy.

> by revoking network you don't lose privacy

Be careful, apps can still communicate with other apps, e.g. revoking the network permission doesn't stop apps from fetching and displaying ads over the network. I don't know enough about Android internals to understand the mechanisms behind it, but clearly there are ways for apps to exfiltrate data.

> Trying to use Network as a complete data exfiltration toggle isn't the intended purpose, and you should always consider apps within the profile being able to communicate for ALL data and access including permissions. It is not something only relevant to Network.

https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/4024-in-what-extent-can-app...

https://github.com/GrapheneOS/os-issue-tracker/issues/2197

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#284

Post by binarin »

anonymousiam wrote: post #179

I took the plunge into GrapheneOS a week ago. I picked up a new Pixel10 Pro and never even tried the stock OS (except to unlock the boot loader). I've got almost everything working the way I want. There were a few non-essential banking apps that won't install. The most annoying problem I had is when I tried to install Strava, which I cannot get working. The app installs, but it will not let me sign in. I guess I need…

The most hilarious is McDonald's app - it refuses to work without Play Integrity check. I wonder what braindamaged reasoning is behind this. Do they want to position themselves as a bank or something?

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#285

Post by microtonal »

driverdan wrote: post #88
Cider9986 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To get a sense of the project and its goals I recommend reading this post[1]. Buying a used Pixel is economical, environmental, and likely doesn't support Google. Pixels are the only secure and open android devices that could work for the project and meet the extensive requirements[2]. This is because GrapheneOS takes real steps to protect user privacy and security, not features that degrade security and don't increa…

It makes sense that an open source project would focus on one series of phones since their time and resources are limited. That said, Google's hardware is behind their competitors and they've had a lot of problems in the past few years. The Pixel 8 Pro has hardware WiFi problems, the 9 and 10 are both minor updates with prices that are far too high, the 10 is eSIM only, etc.

The Pixel 9 had a vastly improved modem and the 10 switched to TSMC for their Tensor SoC, resulting in better performance and better battery life/less heat.

It's true that the SoCs are not that great for an expensive flagship phone, but the trick is buying a Pixel halfway the cycle, when the prices go to mid-range. For instance, currently in my country:

- Pixel 10 is 350 Euro off (currently 549 Euro).

- Pixel 10 Pro is 360 Euro off (currently 739 Euro).

- Pixel 10 Pro XL is 360 Euro off (currently 939 Euro).

- The Pixel A series are less interesting currently, because it's still early in the cycle, but the 9a is 200 Euro off (349) and the 10a is 120 Euro off (428). It's a shame that they switched to last-gen SoCs and modems now on the A-series now.

I know that the Pixel 100 is coming soon-ish, but the 10 series have floated around those price points since 5-6 months after the release.

the 10 is eSIM only

Looking at my P10P with physical SIM. I guess you are in the US?

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#286

Post by throawayonthe »

hparadiz wrote: post #160
_carbyau_ wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Banks don't want the headache of supporting multiple weird phone OSes and it's understandable. Commercially, this makes sense. I am surprised that most nations of the whole world are fine with every citizen relying on one of two american companies for their lifestyle interactions though. I would have thought more nations would legislate their banks must support other options for sheer sovereign resilience.

> Commercially, this makes sense. Does it though? The people in this thread are like "just use a card". Well I've done that for years and had my card skimmed, lost, and stolen over the years. The cost wasn't trivial either. The credit card company knocked it off my balance but also lost on sales when I didn't have my card while they issued me a new one. It cost the credit card company actual money in both lost sales…

whether a device is rooted kinda does matter from this pov as it undoes a lot of the security assumptions on android...

however grapheneos isn't rooted anyway

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#287

Post by davidwritesbugs »

LeoPanthera wrote: post #280
bigiain wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Memories of Apple force pushing a U2 album to everyone's iPod (or maybe iPhone) back in the day.

That was a hilariously tone-deaf incident, but it's hardly comparable. Google pushed ads. Apple gave you a free album.

Yes, but a _U2_ album. An ad is 30 seconds of irritation, but a U2 album is like having broken glass sown under your skin.

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#288

Post by flaburgan »

DarkUranium wrote: post #165
donalhunt wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are players in the OpenStreetMap ecosystem attempting to change that. I know the team behind Organic Maps are actively working to make their app as viable as possible by sourcing appropriate data for example.

Organic Maps is amazing. I actually find that it blows Google Maps out of the water for cycling (which is why/how I discovered it). I haven't really used it for driving much because my own car has a builtin nav, so can't really comment on that. YMMV of course.

Organic Maps has been forked to CoMaps as a community managed project btw

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#289

Post by flaburgan »

wolvoleo wrote: post #170
fooqux wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree and have moved mostly away from everything Google. But it's hard to replace maps. I know open street maps exists but it's hard to beat Google's data gathering.

I think OSM is way way better. It has every little path in the hills I walk. On Google Maps I'm just walking in a featureless green blob. OSM even has unofficial trails that are no more than a worn-down line in the brush. Maybe for cars Google is better but I don't use those. But even there I see really detailed stats. OSMAnd is a really great full featured mapping app. A real tool that you can configure in detail. A…

Don't forget to update the business hours in OSM when you see they are missing / wrong

Re: GrapheneOS has been ported to Android 17

#290

Post by microtonal »

dredmorbius wrote: post #213
mvdtnz wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how it's relevant. I couldn't possibly have made it any more clear I would not buy a Google device, new or used, because I don't like Google.

That's a value judgement, and it's a fair one. It does throw an additional constraint in the works though. FWIW, I've been looking at the mobile / portable computing space fairly intensively for a month or so. I share your quite dim view of Google. GrapheneOS does seem to be one of the most attractive Android alternatives. There are also Lineage (based on CyanogenMod), AOSP, KaiOS (based on AOSP, via Firefox OS), Lig…

If you want full freedom / maximal privacy, and are prepared to make compromises on capabilities and battery life, look at one of the Linux-based, non-Android options. I've heard of quite a few bugs with these.

Most of them also have really bad security, for various reasons, including:

- Since virtually no hardware vendor (outside Jolla) supports non-Android phones, they typically use phones that were made by their ODMs as Android phones and rely on kernel/firmware/device trees made available for those Android builds. Sadly, nobody outside Google (PixelOS) and Samsung really cares about giving their kernels and firmware timely updates. So usually the kernel and firmware are full of known holes (Qualcomm and others do monthly bulletins).

- For many reasons, Linux systems have never really focused on proper security isolation and sandboxing. So most of these phones have really poor isolation and you are only one browser/image parsing/... vulnerability away from full phone compromise.

- Unlocked bootloaders or otherwise compromised boot chain. So, it's easy for persistent malware to compromise a phone and there is no way to attest that the system runs unmodified binaries (as you can e.g. can with GrapheneOS' auditor or Android phones with fully verified boot and Strongbox).

Let's say, if I was a bank, I can understand why I would want to block such devices.

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