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USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
91–100 of 127 posts
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#92IMHO this is a classic example of extreme overcomplexity leading to fragility and regulatory capture along with increased opportunities for antiuser hostility. Practically all devices needed nothing more than +/- on a robust barrel jack, but now we have negotiable voltage (with disasterous consequences if there is a bug in the inherently software-driven process --- which will certainly happen) pushing insane amounts of current through a tiny effete connector with barely-visible pins, "authentication" schemes to enforce vendor lock-in under the guise of protection, and entire regions legally mandating this flustercuck.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#93IMHO this is a classic example of extreme overcomplexity leading to fragility and regulatory capture along with increased opportunities for antiuser hostility. Practically all devices needed nothing more than +/- on a robust barrel jack, but now we have negotiable voltage (with disasterous consequences if there is a bug in the inherently software-driven process --- which will certainly happen) pushing insane amounts…
The consequences of plugging the wrong voltage or polarity into a barrel jack, most of which are compatible enough, is pretty bad. Ask me how I know.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#94Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's an otherwise decent shortwave radio out there that was originally charged with a micro-usb, then they released a "new" USB-C model...except it will only charge with a 5V brick because they literally just swapped out the ports. Really annoying.
I'd imagine that a significant portion of the shortwave radio community is capable of soldering in the two resistors.
If the board had unpopulated 0802 pads, I absolutely would be.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#95Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's close, but it's not quite complete. There seems to be lots of confusion here, and that's natural: It is confusing. For just-getting-power from a USB A port into a USB C peripheral: There are supposed to be 2 resistors in the peripheral device [always], and also 1 resistor within the cable for USB-to-legacy cables[1]. That's 3 resistors, total, to get a relatively dumb USB-C equipped peripheral device to reliab…
My point, which matches what you've written out in more detail, is that there's supposed to be stuff (resistors) in the cable, stuff which is often not there. There are plenty of these abhorrent cables in the wild. And when you come across one, things get weird, because some sources and sinks deviate from the standard in ways that make them work with these bad cables. Others don't do that. (I believe there were a lot…
I gathered that you knew that. I'm mostly just trying to complete the picture for those following along at home, who might find some of this resistor business to be a bit weird compared to the USBs of yore.
Except the old ways were weird in unseen ways, too. Some combinations of cable, phone, and charger worked well and some barely worked at all.
We're in much better shape with USB C and PD. It's generally a good, forward-looking way of doing all kinds of things.
I just wish the cables and ports were better-marked, and that manufacturers stopped fucking around by making non-compliant stuff, and that there were a clear way with two battery-equipped USB C devices to unequivocally declare that a particular one will charge the other (and not the other way 'round).
And yes: The non-compliant widgets should ideally be named, shamed, and Widlarized -- not simply tolerated or worked around.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#96Earlier quoted context omitted.
They mean bad USB-A to C cables with no resistor on CC line. Of course this is broken junk which will work with some devices and won't with others. I've also seen cables with resistors on both CC lines, which is also broken but in a slightly subtler way.
But it’s not what anyone was talking about. Such a cable should be really quite rare because it’s unlikely to work at all in most situations, whereas devices with USB-C ports that don’t work with PD chargers (due to a cent’s worth of missing Rd resistors) are irritatingly common, because they do work with USB-C to A cables!
Huh? It seems clear to me that this is what exmadscientist was talking about, any other interpretation just doesn't make sense.
And no, such cables would still work in plenty of cases. You usually get them by having them bundled with devices they do work well with. In fact, they always work fine with the kind of devices you mention. These cables aren't as common as USB-C-shaped junk that's missing resistors on the receptacle, but I stumbled upon them anyway and I didn't really try to.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#97I've basically stopped buying any portable electronics unless they take USB-C. Currently travelling with a laptop, watch, toothbrush, eReader, camera, bug-bite treater, and phone - all charging from the same power brick. I'm guaranteed of getting a replacement cable / charger wherever I am in the world if I need it. The only slight snag is some cheaper itema refuse to use PD and insist on plain 5V/2A - buy most decen…
> Amusingly, most of the buses I've taken recently also have USB-C ports on them for ad hoc charging.
I've been pleasantly surprised recently when I plugged in my OnePlus into the bus in a medium/small Belgian city and saw the supervooc animation. (And it was actually fast charging, a 8 minute ride gave about 15% battery.)
For anyone wondering about technical details, PPS chargers now show up as supervooc apparently.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#98IMHO this is a classic example of extreme overcomplexity leading to fragility and regulatory capture along with increased opportunities for antiuser hostility. Practically all devices needed nothing more than +/- on a robust barrel jack, but now we have negotiable voltage (with disasterous consequences if there is a bug in the inherently software-driven process --- which will certainly happen) pushing insane amounts…
The consequences of plugging the wrong voltage or polarity into a barrel jack, most of which are compatible enough, is pretty bad. Ask me how I know.
That's still far simpler and more obvious than the insanity of USB-C. Looking at all the complaints about "noncompliance" makes it much clearer.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#99Earlier quoted context omitted.
The consequences of plugging the wrong voltage or polarity into a barrel jack, most of which are compatible enough, is pretty bad. Ask me how I know.
That's still far simpler and more obvious than the insanity of USB-C. Looking at all the complaints about "noncompliance" makes it much clearer.
This is purely a standards problem. The working group had to say "you don't get the logo unless you do PD" and have logo. They waited a DECADE to do that, which missed the boat, and when they did it they focused on transfer speed and wattage markings instead of a single stamp.
Re: USB Power Delivery: Plugging into the Benefits
#100240 watts over a USB-C connector? What next, USB toasters and coffee pots?
I remember scoffing years ago at USB powered coffee warmers. Maybe the situation has changed.
The Ember cups could have used PD! But the cables would have been more expensive, as would have the power brick (and you would have had bad user experiences plugging into less powerful USB power supplies)