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Not everyone is using AI for everything

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Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#321

Post by demorro »

laichzeit0 wrote: post #251
throwatdem12311 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They say this every time. Just wait for the NEXT model bro THEN everything will be be fixed. Ok wait maybe not the next one but surely the one after! Hasn’t happened yet and there is no evidence it will.

This all reminds me of in the 90s when the Borland C++ compilers and Turbo Pascal shit came out and everyone was still hand rolling assembler because the optimising compilers were so bad. I thought Opus 4.6 was pretty good, basically a step change. The stuff I got out of Fable before they blocked it was nearly alien. If things keep improving, I don’t see humans writing code in 2 to 3 years except maybe super niche ar…

In every case up until now, a jump in abstraction has moved us forwards in ease of understanding the underlying artifact at a conceptual, human level. High level languages are effectively runnable documentation.

It's possible to say that LLMs producing code may be the same category of thing, but the non-determinism and ephemerality of it all makes it difficult to imagine.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#322

Post by kaydub »

I'd honestly argue we're actually going the complete opposite direction.

Everybody is using LLMs/AI. All the time. It's in every facet of your life. Just because you didn't input the prompt, doesn't mean you're not consuming the end product of LLMs all day, everyday, on websites like this one, reddit, tiktok, instagram, facebook, etc.

Addressing the article, if you're hyperfocused on whether people are using AI and only consider AI use a chatbot... well, you're not honestly covering all the AI use out there. And reading the other stats, it seems like this article is trying to paint a narrative. Why is the Datos stat only considering "Desktop use" for instance.

Not to mention their stats are actually astounding and DON'T show what the headline is trying to assert. 1/3 of people using AI regularly is a FUCK TON of people in a VERY short span of time to uptake a new technology.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#323

Post by aduwah »

hypfer wrote: post #82
acc_297 wrote: post #72

On the post-grad job hunt right now - I note that most employers will ask in a technical interview or whiteboard interview "how are you using LLMs?" It's tough to answer because you want to hedge for both an AI enthused employer and an AI hesitant employer with limited information about who they are and how they personally use these products. I've been responding with a sort of long winded answer about how 'there is…

> It's tough to answer because you want to hedge for both an AI enthused employer and an AI hesitant employer with limited information about who they are and how they personally use these products. Have you considered just answering truthfully? Would you even want to work somewhere where you need to play a role and where they flip out when you say the wrong word you should've correctly guessed through mind reading? T…

"Have you considered just answering truthfully?"

Said by no-one who has a decent paying job and has bills to pay

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#324

Post by demorro »

tty456 wrote: post #247
tripleee wrote: post #174

I fear AI is going to be used for everything not because it's the best solution, but because people are inherently lazy and just want to get their thing done, and they don't care so much about the quality. "low effort and convenient" seems to consistently win over "best quality" and this is going to be a downgrade in everything, for everyone

I assume for a lot of people, an llm is going to produce higher quality results for most knowledge tasks than they could do on their own. I think that's okay

It's practically guaranteed. Most people will have no more need to learn how to perform miscellaneous knowledge tasks well if at all, and thus won't.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#325

Post by watwut »

monkpit wrote: post #260
d_silin wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not. I made that choice in the past and will do it again. "Speak the truth, even if your voice shakes"

You should really examine your situation and beliefs if you think this isn’t a privileged position to be in.

Highly paid enginners hiding behind "I have no choice I would be hungry" are usually just lying to themselves.

And you dont even get these nearly as often from people who work in lower paid positions. Or who are actually making moral tradeoffs that affects their income.

I have seen engineers take paycut or risk it because of this or that moral conviction. Not wanting to lie to customer, refusing job for gambling company, working one day less per week so that he volunteers for biblical something.

Just telling management no or just communicating about your work with ai or lack of it are not even one of those.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#326

Post by kakacik »

reg_dunlop wrote: post #274
monkpit wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should really examine your situation and beliefs if you think this isn’t a privileged position to be in.

We live in an ecosystem where we (engineers/developers) can promote ourselves and display our skills/acumen/values/professionalism/responsibility in an unequivocal way. Regardless of your experience level. I bootstrapped myself from poverty to Staff software engineer, past the age of 45. Is that privileged? Or sheer will and force of effort? I am not unique. I am an example.

OK how about some real achievements in life, is raising kids the hard way? Career is but a small portion of QoL and overall achievements as human beings, basically all of us software devs these days live have very above-average incomes although most feel like they are deserved or even not enough. So studying from poverty to software is an achievement and big move, usually, but what specific position afterwards is not that important or impressive, its just a question of a) mental capacity, mostly genetic and b) effort put into work, while not elsewhere.

Ie I increased my salary, doing same job, all 100% perm position, roughly 30x compared to my first fulltime software dev job after university. Who cares? It doesn't mean anything, just an afterthought. I am father of 2 small kids, and trying my best to be a good father and role model, often succeeding, sometimes failing. Its by far the hardest effort of my life, it takes relentless 20-25 years and I see otherwise brilliant folks failing at this hard left and right.

Also I wish folks in IT were a bit more humble and considered other engineering careers, with +- same effort taking to get a degree, and much worse career progress/compensation/freedom to choose one's path. Arrogance is much more rare there.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#327

Post by knollimar »

d_silin wrote: post #238
pesus wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This a very condescending and privileged comment. The job market is much different when you're just starting out, and it's especially brutal these days for new grads.

It is not. I made that choice in the past and will do it again. "Speak the truth, even if your voice shakes"

What if the way you use AI isn't particularly important to you? Are you willing to sacrifice employment for a principle you wouldn't draw as a line in the sand?

Sometimes it's okay to say "I don't know" and it's okay to say "I don't care" and it's okay to say "It doesn't matter much to me".

Every interview is corpospeak where you infer the intended meaning of words anyway.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#328

Post by ticulatedspline »

spoaceman7777 wrote: post #270

It's important to factor in just how many US adults are basically illiterate nowadays. As of 2023, 27% of American working-age adults were at a PIAAC Literacy Level of 1 or below, out of a total of 5 levels. This has gotten drastically worse in the past 10 years as, in 2013, Level 1 and below was only 17%. Full scores for 2023 are: % Level 1 or below: 27% Level 2: 29% Level 3: 31% Level 4/5: 13% For reference, Level…

those levels weren't what I was expecting.

https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/piaac/measure.asp?section=1&sub_...

I'm curious as to how I would score, I would definitely count myself as "literate" but I wonder how well I'd do on the level 4/5 tasks and if they cross over into more general memory, intelligence, and study habit metrics that even a normally "literate" person would not do well at.

Though given those descriptions I can't help thinking those would be great tests for AI. I'd love to see the proficiency scores for various models.

EDIT: Ok I just needed to scroll further, they have sample items in the last section up to level 4 and even at level 4 the question seemed trivial.

The most wordy one is the Q Drum article (which by the way Q drum is a real thing, kinda neat idea) and there's literally only two basic criticisms (flat land and expense) and if you had any idea what the life straw is you can probably construe what the similar criticism in the email is going to be without even looking.

Based on the scores and the proficiency description I assumed they were actually targeting some sort of normal distribution and levels 4/5 would be genuinely difficult explaining the scores. I'm now much more sad that the scores are so low.

At least I got a laugh at how they refer to each test item as "the stimulus" which has such a sterile/clinical flavor to it.

Re: Not everyone is using AI for everything

#329

Post by GlacierFox »

monkpit wrote: post #282
reg_dunlop wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We live in an ecosystem where we (engineers/developers) can promote ourselves and display our skills/acumen/values/professionalism/responsibility in an unequivocal way. Regardless of your experience level. I bootstrapped myself from poverty to Staff software engineer, past the age of 45. Is that privileged? Or sheer will and force of effort? I am not unique. I am an example.

Privilege, yes. You had the privilege to dedicate time to learning skills required, obtaining an education, probably bias during hiring processes, etc. Even though your position might be the result of effort on your part, you do have to acknowledge that you’re privileged to be in a position to expend that effort on what you want, instead of something else, like finding fresh water daily, or whatever. It’s not sheer w…

How far could you reduce this down? Do you only clap for malnourished Ethiopian babies that can't find waterthat grow up into full silicon Valley software engineers?
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