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Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

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Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#111

Post by GlacierFox »

danpalmer wrote: post #77
socalgal2 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you're responding to incorrect summaries? He was not intolerant of woman in the workplace. His memo was specifically in support of women in the workplace. https://web.archive.org/web/20170813080340/https://www.theat...

No, I read the memo. What I was not doing is taking him at his word that he "values diversity and inclusion", I was reading his actual words and the sexist dogwhistles. Stating acceptance does not absolve other intolerance. We must also look at the effect of his memo, which was to alienate many, and which caused a backlash that led to his firing. The company did not make a big deal of it just to fire him, it was indi…

[flagged]

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#112

Post by erq164 »

jensensbutton wrote: post #100
3adk1a wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wasn't unhinged, he somewhat clumsily posted evolutionary biology literature fragments on a channel where it would offend parts of the readers. In response to a "let a thousand flowers bloom and speak your mind" request from Google management snakes. The problem is that some tech people take these requests seriously. Google of course has identified itself as Trump sycophants and hypocrites by now. Maybe they shoul…

No he was kind of unhinged. That wasn't the first weird thing he did. Should've been fired.

That is hard for outsiders to know. Google however seems to foster cancel mobs.

Python core people like Thomas Wouters and Gregory P. Smith, since fired from Google, canceled and libeled people like Tim Peters. All that matters is having a mob on your side and preventing the other side from responding.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#113

Post by dekhn »

JuniperMesos wrote: post #12

[flagged]

I think if Damore had limited his criticism to the corporate DEI (which I found to be a bit heavy-handed and prone to critical theory groupthink) in a short doc, he probably would have been a bit more successful (in helping Google rein back its DEI training).

One rarely stated thing I learned over time working there is that managers read eng-misc and will prevent you from transferring to their team if they didn't like what you said, or how you said it, or who you said it to.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#114

Post by tmoertel »

jensensbutton wrote: post #100
3adk1a wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He wasn't unhinged, he somewhat clumsily posted evolutionary biology literature fragments on a channel where it would offend parts of the readers. In response to a "let a thousand flowers bloom and speak your mind" request from Google management snakes. The problem is that some tech people take these requests seriously. Google of course has identified itself as Trump sycophants and hypocrites by now. Maybe they shoul…

No he was kind of unhinged. That wasn't the first weird thing he did. Should've been fired.

What other things did he do to make you believe he was “kind of unhinged”? I know about the memo thing, but I think it was covered in an inflammatory way because the press loves to play up a controversy. What else besides the memo incident did he do that merits his firing?

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#116

Post by JuniperMesos »

mempko wrote: post #96
JuniperMesos wrote: post #12

[flagged]

[flagged]

I think there's a lot more political will now than there was a decade ago for explicitly repealing the sections of American civil rights law that define what a "hostile workplace" is, in order to make sure that something like Damore's memo would not count. Certainly, this is something I think about when evaluating political candidates.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#117

Post by bryrei »

CMay wrote: post #78
ashleyn wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering they rolled back DEI along with everyone else after Trump's second victory, it's difficult to view those previous "values" as anything other than cynical kissing-up to the previous holders of power.

For what it's worth, I think for an organization that size that needs the best talent from anywhere, It's probably much better to discourage political activism at work. It can tend to turn away the most logical and reasonable well grounded people who want no part of it. The people who _need_ work to be political can go get hired for explicitly political organizations where that is the job. Creating a distaste in peop…

Most people don't force politics into work as much as they have it forced upon them by, you know, living in a society. And the idea of "political activism" causing "distaste in people without like minds" is a misattribution, putting it mildly. But yeah, keep people quiet and heads down so the work can get done, regardless of what the work is or what it will be used for.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#118

Post by GlacierFox »

mempko wrote: post #99
zerobees wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right. I have respect for Rene, but going by the "HN quitting manifestos" like this, Google has lost its moral compass at least 50 times at various points in the last 20 years. The company is constantly changing, but also hasn't changed all that much. It always talked the talk and was eager to tell others how to behave, but was almost never willing to give up any real revenue to do the right thing. The usual justific…

Why do you have respect for Rene?

He doesn't. People start off with that when they're scared of voicing their actual opinion and it softens whatever they have to say a touch.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#119

Post by dekhn »

socalgal2 wrote: post #72
danpalmer wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Sounds like you're responding to incorrect summaries? He was not intolerant of woman in the workplace. His memo was specifically in support of women in the workplace. https://web.archive.org/web/20170813080340/https://www.theat...

That is not a remotely accurate representation of what he wrote.

Re: Why I'm Forced to Say Farewell: Google Management Has Lost Its Moral Compass

#120

Post by saintfire »

I see everyone coming up with an arbitrary date of when Google lost their moral compass that aligns with their own moral compass. In that vein, I feel like when Brin and Page released a paper stating how PageRank could never be beneficial to a consumer with ads and then launched an ad company powered by page rank is when Google became evil.
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