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A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

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Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#371

Post by Lerc »

boricj wrote: post #368
nicbou wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the French government more responsive than those of neighbouring countries?

Probably because we have a well established history of regularly changing regimes. Since we overthrew royalty in 1789 we've had five republics, two empires, three monarchies and a bunch of short-lived totalitarian regimes, coups and other major political events. If anything, the longevity of the Fifth Republic is starting to become unusual (only the Third Republic and the Ancien Régime have lasted longer). Maybe we'r…

How well did they turn out for people each time?

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#372

Post by ozim »

protocolture wrote: post #367
zug_zug wrote: post #279

It's exhausting that the "solution" to problems like this is getting tens or hundreds of thousands of citizens stressed until enough public attention gives some small chance of redress. I'm not calling for violence, but if we can't get these things fixed in court there has to be a more effect and more forceful avenue for protest than venting on internet forums.

Whats the problem here? Farmer gives land to city. City goes "We can have 10 million dollars AND a brand new data center, hot diggity" City is enriched in both money AND services. Thanks Mr Farmer.

Farmer donates land for a park

If you are my friend and I gift you a nice item … I would be majorly pissed at you and would not talk to you ever again if you would sell it online.

I would expect you give it back or pass for free to someone who is also close to you.

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#373

Post by gambiting »

ipdashc wrote: post #294
hmokiguess wrote: post #283

Can it be both? Trying to think of a data centre themed expedition now where you go visit the robots and interact with the machines

You know, you joke (I think?) but data center companies could genuinely at least open up for tours to try to appeal to the public, if public approval is apparently such a concern. It's funny that they haven't done it at all yet. Think nuclear power plants in the 60s or 70s, many of them were open for tours or school field trips or such to try to make them more appealing to the populace around them. I haven't heard of…

[dead]

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#374

Post by Lerc »

cyanydeez wrote: post #348
zug_zug wrote: post #279

It's exhausting that the "solution" to problems like this is getting tens or hundreds of thousands of citizens stressed until enough public attention gives some small chance of redress. I'm not calling for violence, but if we can't get these things fixed in court there has to be a more effect and more forceful avenue for protest than venting on internet forums.

yeah, it's interesting how we're not allowed to call for violence, eh.

The problem is that, while there are times when violent acts may bring about positive outcomes, it is extremely rare for those outcomes to be in the minds of those committing the acts. It is far more common for someone to commit violence as an expression of their anger, while rationalising that it is justified because they are aware of the arguments in favour of violence apply to whatever it is that they really want to do in the moment.

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#375

Post by mystraline »

cyanydeez wrote: post #348
zug_zug wrote: post #279

It's exhausting that the "solution" to problems like this is getting tens or hundreds of thousands of citizens stressed until enough public attention gives some small chance of redress. I'm not calling for violence, but if we can't get these things fixed in court there has to be a more effect and more forceful avenue for protest than venting on internet forums.

yeah, it's interesting how we're not allowed to call for violence, eh.

We absolutely CAN call for violence. And especially political violence. Theres even a TV show with it as a name.

Its calling for "Law and Order". Its violence against the 'correct group'.

You absolutely can call for violence (now) against protestors, ANTIFA, anti-surveillance (DEFLOCK), unionists, homeless, drug users, and other deemed by federal, state, and local officials as undesirable.

You cant directly call for violence to black people by name, but eupamisms are still fine to allude to. "Those people", "ghetto", etc.

And the violence BY police and government way exceed the violence by the public they target.

Also, thou shalt NEVER advocate for violence against CEOs, business leaders, politicians, and the like. Their lives are worth like 1M of us plebes. So those who come to their defense will do so crazily and way over-respond, like cops do routinely.

Thats why the feds threw threw the book at Luigi Mangione. Cause if he did it, his way is illegal but tremendously effective. And the elites have little defense against this.

(Case in point. In my local area, a person took $100 from a cash register, and got arrested for a class A misdemeanor and 2 other charges. Whereas the same restaurant had their owner committed mass wage theft of 27 people to the tune of $72000, and only had to pay a fine.

There absolutely hypocrisy who can advocate and not for violence.)

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#376

Post by Aloisius »

hilbert42 wrote: post #338
fylo wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're edging on terrorism

What is left when all other options are exhausted? The American War of Independence, French Revolution and English Civil War were acts of terrorism. Were those acts justified? Not if you're the ones who were initially holding the power.

Calling the American Revolution terrorism, in the modern sense, is a stretch. It was a war waged primarily between soldiers and materiel with the goal of ending the enemy's ability to wage war.

Systematic use of terror as a policy to induce fear in the general public to push them to coerce their government's policy was not widely used.

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#377

Post by mlyle »

Leonard_of_Q wrote: post #366
snickerbockers wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That won't work when your tour guide can't even answer questions about what the computers do because theyre all running VMs that are rented out on an ad-hoc basis.

The tour guide could just give that answer to any such question. It'd be comparable to the answer given to someone who wants to know what that new railroad which was built where there used to be fields or forest is used for: people ride it to go somewhere, freight is passing over it going places. Having said this I do feel like these data centres should be built in such a way that waste heat is used in some way. Use…

Waste heat from power plants isn’t always useful because it is low grade heat… but it is still much, much, much better than the 35-60C water you could get from a data center.

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#378

Post by lovich »

Innittech wrote: post #260

Are deeds with conditions like that legal in that jurisdiction?

I know they can’t be permanent because of the rule against perpetuities[1], but since this was in 99 I don’t think that applies.

IMO the non permanent nature of these sorts of grants is a good thing because if we don’t have limitations then we’ll eventually end up in a necrocacy where the long dead have more say over how property and the government is managed than the living.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_against_perpetuities

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#379

Post by bumby »

BurningFrog wrote: post #370
josephg wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw a clip the other day of an American comedian doing crowd work in Paris. He asked the audience what America should do, and the French said - something like - they should punch the police more and light things on fire. To me that sounds crazy! But, I can see how it works for the French. They protest all the time, and the government is very responsive to the needs of the people. Much more so than the American gove…

By what measure does it work for the French? They have 8% unemployment, 30% less GDP per capita than the US, and many other problems. Government by caving in to riots is not in general being responsive to the needs of the people.

Well gee, to start France has higher healthcare quality/access, higher life expectancy, much lower treatable mortality, better work-life balance (less hours worked, more guaranteed leave), lower wealth inequality, higher voter turnout (indicative of less apathy or less efforts to disenfranchise), among others.

One of the problems with just using economic metrics is it seems to confuse the fact that the economy is supposed to serve society, not the other way around. So it leads one to wonder: with those better economic measures, what is it buying for US citizens?

Re: A Farmer Donated Land to Turn into a Park. The City Is Building a Data Center

#380

Post by protocolture »

mystraline wrote: post #369
protocolture wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whats the problem here? Farmer gives land to city. City goes "We can have 10 million dollars AND a brand new data center, hot diggity" City is enriched in both money AND services. Thanks Mr Farmer.

No. Farmer SELLS land (for $10) with a deed restriction that it is to be used for a public park. Hand wavey timey wimey... Deed restriction 'magically' goes away. Gets sold for $10M.

So a city should tie its hands permanently because of a gift? Donations can now override city planning?

Tired of paying property tax? Gift your house to the city with a deed that says they have to rent it back to you forever for $1 a year?

Lets be clear, this wouldnt even be news if it wasnt for "Datacentre"

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