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Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

reuters.com

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Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#461

Post by InsideOutSanta »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #79

I understand Apple's position on this one. This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data. It is also a very useful feature. The EU regulators are disallowing guardrails without which this backdoor will be used to strip-mine people's personal data. The privacy implications are not legible to most people. If I was more cynical I would suggest that this is being used as an end-run around encryption, since the enc…

How is it a backdoor if I, as my data's actual owner, intentionally provide access to my data?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#462

Post by wrxd »

yandie wrote: post #75
epolanski wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet Gemini had no issues to comply with EU's DMA and release on all phones? Let's call it how it is: Android phones allow every competitor to run their chatbot in place of Gemini. Want Perplexity instead of Gemini? You can have it. Samsung launches with Perplexity as of late. Apple? As always, went into "ay mate, too integrated, can't give the same APIs to competitors" lame excuse.

Appples architecture prevents them from seeing customers data (see Private Cloud Compute documentation). Data that Gemini Assistant (not referring to the distilled version Apple uses) see goes straight to Google. Big difference here. Weird to say it but the only assistant with any guarantee for privacy by design is Siri at the moment.

What prevents to have an API that requires something akin Private Cloud Compute from other providers?

Technically makes the implementation of other providers harder but in principle it should be possible, no?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#463

Post by epolanski »

yandie wrote: post #251
epolanski wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the source of this claim that this is the reason?

https://security.apple.com/blog/expanding-pcc/ The code is open source: https://github.com/apple/security-pcc

Doesn't mention neither the EU nor DMA.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#464

Post by Kovah »

viktorcode wrote: post #414
Kovah wrote: post #408

If you are, like me, one of the EU customers that are again disappointed by Apple's behavior, please take 5 minutes to send Apple feedback about that: https://www.apple.com/feedback/iphone/

Or, write to your European MP.

To do what exactly?

Apple does not adhere to EU law. It's their task to either go with the local law, or leave their customers hanging. And I rightfully express my disappointment that they currently do the latter.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#465

Post by Saline9515 »

solid_fuel wrote: post #449
christkv wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None. The EU is getting more and more un democratic by the year. More power centralized in the bureaucracy vis regulations and other mechanisms.

You have anything to back up that claim, or is it just knee-jerk drivel with no evidence based on your feelings and distrust of scary government bureaucrats?

Why is chatcontrol being pushed every year by the european commission, while people and their representatives are in majority against it?

Besides given the amount of lobbying in the EU institutions, it's obvious that citizens don't have a chance against corpos with infinite money.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#466

Post by Saline9515 »

yxhuvud wrote: post #454
redviperpt wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU "voters" don't get a say in any of this.

What are you talking about, DMA has passed in the parliament.

The parliament doesn't get to choose the laws it has to vote. The parliament can't repell a law, and doesn't hold the pen during negociations.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#467

Post by yxhuvud »

bambax wrote: post #343
eykanal wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google eng mgr here. I've worked on a few projects related to compliance with various government policies. This isn't "assign a two-pizza team to it, will be done in a quarter"; these types of compliance efforts can mean completely redoing multiple core systems to handle privacy, wipeout, audit, reporting, per-location policies, etc etc. These efforts can involve hundreds to thousands of people for multiple years. Su…

So? It's also more effort to work everyday to earn a living than simply stealing what you need from your neighbors at gunpoint. But the law's the law. As a European I'm conflicted because I think this particular set of privacy laws are overreaching bordering on stupid; but "exemptions" for one of the richest corporations on earth would be beyond absurd and infinitely worse.

This is a competition law, not a privacy law.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#468

Post by Andrew_nenakhov »

slekker wrote: post #338
Nifty3929 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, exactly! Also forced EU voters to consider how much they value these services, and whether the regulations are worth it not to have them, or to have watered down versions of them. I say this without judgment - I see it as a legitimate area of consideration. I think the worst is hugely impactful laws for which exceptions are constantly carved out so nobody can truly evaluate whether the law/reg is a good one or n…

I value them a lot, happy that the EU didnt bend down to Apple. If it werent for the EU, the companies would get away with all sorts of shit. Is as if people forget companies are evil by nature and will fuck you any chance they get.

[flagged]

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#469

Post by bootsmann »

connorjewiss wrote: post #460

DMA is one of the worst things for tech and innovation. The EU is aggressive time an time again with its interpretations of the DMA.

DMA is killing innovation by, checks notes, not allowing Apple to lock out competitor products from competing on an even playing field?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#470

Post by yxhuvud »

zdragnar wrote: post #58
epolanski wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet Gemini had no issues to comply with EU's DMA and release on all phones? Let's call it how it is: Android phones allow every competitor to run their chatbot in place of Gemini. Want Perplexity instead of Gemini? You can have it. Samsung launches with Perplexity as of late. Apple? As always, went into "ay mate, too integrated, can't give the same APIs to competitors" lame excuse.

If the options are "launch in the rest of the world quickly and get to the EU later" or "launch everywhere at once years after the competition" PMs and execs are going to choose the latter every time.

The third option is: launch in a way that is compliant with EU rules everywhere. Except they don't want that as they want to retain their outsized market power.
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