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Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

reuters.com

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Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#451

Post by pembrook »

speedgoose wrote: post #257

I find it interesting that Apple prefers to fall behind in Europe rather than opening their platform a tiny bit. It gives us European some opportunities. I have a side project at work that was heavily threatened by Siri’s new features. Now I feel more relaxed as Siri isn’t coming there anytime soon. But overall I doubt we will replace Apple.

> It gives us European some opportunities...Now I feel more relaxed as Siri isn’t coming anytime soon.

We've had endless opportunities to compete during Apple's entire 50 year existence.

As someone living in Europe I feel ashamed to read you openly admitting this. This sentiment would feel at home in the USSR.

Instead of trying to create things the world finds useful by building something better/cheaper/more innovative, we're choosing protectionism so we can screw our customers with inferior products they're forced to buy...and relax.

I think we've done enough relaxing in Europe.

We were the birthplace of the industrial revolution...the technologies of which went on to bring the entire world out of poverty last century.

Do we seriously have nothing valuable to contribute to the world during the entirety of the digital revolution? If not, I think our decline and collapsing social welfare systems are deserved.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#452

Post by yxhuvud »

ghaff wrote: post #446
burnte wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not as if Apple doesn't have the money to dedicate a team to matching the EU's requirements on a deadline. They just choose not to. Exactly, that's actually why I LIKE this decision so much. I'm not on Apple's side, but I REALLY like the idea that a company just says, "Fine, we'll comply by not even offering this product." It's a perfectly legitimate choice, and it FORCED Apple to evaluate the pros and cons. I…

Yes. If a company in another country elects not to deliver a product or feature because of local regulations, consumers should take that up with their local legislators. That company has no obligation to sell something just because local consumers want it. And if those consumers want to bypass local regulations in some manner, that's their business.

Market pressure is a pretty strong obligation to their shareholders. I expect Apple to fold, eventually.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#453

Post by theshrike79 »

andix wrote: post #253

It's totally fine that Apple doesn't release this feature for EU customers. If they think they can still sell enough phones it's also fine I guess. What's not fine, is to blame the EU for the missing feature. It's damaging their brand and damaging their reputation. Just think about if Porsche would make a press release and calling the US tariffs "un-American". Wouldn't be perceived well either.

You know what would also damage their brand?

Fancois Normal installing a 3rd party AI service which turns out to have zero security and actively just harvesting private data.

Tell me which company in your opinion would be in the LOUD headlines, Apple or the random 3rd party?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#454

Post by yxhuvud »

redviperpt wrote: post #442
Nifty3929 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, exactly! Also forced EU voters to consider how much they value these services, and whether the regulations are worth it not to have them, or to have watered down versions of them. I say this without judgment - I see it as a legitimate area of consideration. I think the worst is hugely impactful laws for which exceptions are constantly carved out so nobody can truly evaluate whether the law/reg is a good one or n…

EU "voters" don't get a say in any of this.

What are you talking about, DMA has passed in the parliament.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#455

Post by speedgoose »

cmelbye wrote: post #353
speedgoose wrote: post #257

I find it interesting that Apple prefers to fall behind in Europe rather than opening their platform a tiny bit. It gives us European some opportunities. I have a side project at work that was heavily threatened by Siri’s new features. Now I feel more relaxed as Siri isn’t coming there anytime soon. But overall I doubt we will replace Apple.

Opening up third party access to read all user data on the device, agentic control over all installed apps, etc. is opening the platform a tiny bit?

From the perspective of the user owning their own data and their own device, yes.

From Apple's strategy board point of view, no.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#456

Post by eastbound »

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #445
shykes wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also forced EU voters to consider how much they value these services It's been a while since I left Europe, and I'm rusty on that particular layer of civics. Do EU voters actually have a say in this kind of regulation? Or is it all decided on the executive side which is only accountable to member states and not to individual citizens?

They do have a say. They can elect representatives who could change the legal framework and the incentives for the bureaucrats, or even remove the ability of the bureaucrats to regulate certain things. Then these regulations would not get passed and that would be that.

We have a say at a 4th level of derived decision, which is 2 levels more than what people call a democracy. Also, the other political party will do it too.

= We don’t have a say. We voted NO to the new EU treaties in 2008 and the new president decided that electing him meant that we approved the same treaties.

They only let us vote when we agree, anyway.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#457

Post by pantulis »

madeofpalk wrote: post #322
gmueckl wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Throwing infinite money at engineering problems doesn't move deadlines arbitrarily. But Apple's position here is actually really wild: Apple claims to protect user privacy all the time. But they can't offer a product in a major jurisdiction that has actually meaningful privacy laws? Didn't they consider that while designing the product? This is quite the contradiction.

No, this isn't the claim. EU wants Apple to open 'Siri AI', with access to a personal context, open to other model/AI providers. Apple says "We can't do this in a privacy preserving way". You can definitely question what their true motivations are, but it seems pretty plausible that there is a moral case for this system to not be opened up to other providers who may do a worse job at privacy than Apple (especially wh…

> EU wants Apple to open 'Siri AI', with access to a personal context, open to other model/AI providers.

Not sure this is the case. My understanding is what the EU wants is that users can use Siri AI or a third party AI service from, say, Anthropic or OpenAI, at the same level of capabilities, just as you can switch default browsers. It's not about the underlying LLM (that would be the huge privacy concern), it's about the product built on top. Of course how a third party AI gets its data from the device would need to be approved by the user and that third party AI provider would have to justify what it's doing with that personal data to the EU watchdogs, just as Apple would need to do.

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