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FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

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Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#191

Post by laughing_man »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #148
IAmBroom wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that is the way federal agencies work. Details of complex systems are decided by (hopefully apolitical, public-good-oriented) specialists in the field of interest. One alternative is that Trump can do it at will. Or, to add a few more steps, Trump can fire the FCC head at will, replace him with a lackey, and then do it at will.

> [Laws] are decided by (hopefully apolitical, public-good-oriented) specialists in the field of interest This doesn't sound to me at all like how a democratic country is supposed to function. It feels like you're describing China rather than the US. > Trump can do it at will. Which is also not how our constitution is supposed to work. The executive branch (which includes both the president and his appointees) is not…

There is a level of detail that isn't practical to include in law. It's pretty normal for Congress to sketch the general outline of regulation and require the relevant bureaucracy to fill in the details.

Though in this particular case, unless this is based on a change to the law it seems like an overreach by the FCC.

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#192

Post by [deleted] »

grishka wrote: post #149

As a Russian: huh, you guys could still just buy a sim card without any kind of identification? Impressive. We had that ID requirement introduced way back in the 00s. Even EU countries seem to require an ID now. When I traveled to France and Belgium in 2024, I bought a French tourist sim card, and the carrier kept sending me some rather insistent messages that my line would get disconnected if I don't upload my passp…

[deleted]

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#193

Post by grishka »

rconti wrote: post #167
grishka wrote: post #149

As a Russian: huh, you guys could still just buy a sim card without any kind of identification? Impressive. We had that ID requirement introduced way back in the 00s. Even EU countries seem to require an ID now. When I traveled to France and Belgium in 2024, I bought a French tourist sim card, and the carrier kept sending me some rather insistent messages that my line would get disconnected if I don't upload my passp…

It seems to depend a lot. It's kind of hard in Germany - they wanted my permanent address. I didn't find France as difficult. Iceland didn't care. Italy wanted my passport. Chile, you virtually needed to be a citizen, as I recall.

> Chile, you virtually needed to be a citizen, as I recall.

I heard something similar about Russia after recent changes actually, it could as well be impossible for non-residents so tourists just stick with international roaming and public wifi. IIRC there's a catch-22 situation where you need a Gosuslugi (online government services portal) account to buy a sim, but you need a Russian phone number to sign up for one. As a citizen, you just need your ID (internal passport).

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#195

Post by Ajedi32 »

mcmcmc wrote: post #170
Ajedi32 wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> [Laws] are decided by (hopefully apolitical, public-good-oriented) specialists in the field of interest This doesn't sound to me at all like how a democratic country is supposed to function. It feels like you're describing China rather than the US. > Trump can do it at will. Which is also not how our constitution is supposed to work. The executive branch (which includes both the president and his appointees) is not…

Administrative law is the (suboptimal) answer to congressional gridlock, which is the real problem. If Congress is incapable of making new laws, we still need them somehow. Regardless the overturning of Chevron deference makes administrative rules like this more susceptible to challenge. Assuming the telcos have the backbone to do so of course.

Congress passes plenty of laws. 95 so far just since the last election: https://www.congress.gov/public-laws/119th-congress Last congress passed 274. It's really only the controversial stuff that gets gridlocked.

The problem is that our government is now so large and complicated that it's simply no longer possible for Congress to effectively set policy for all of it. (This would be true even if they weren't so polarized.) So instead they just keep delegating more and more power to the executive branch.

The Administrative Procedures Act, Congressional Review Act, and the recent overturning of Chevron are all good checks on executive/agency power here, but I don't think any of them solves the fundamental issue that the executive branch was simply never designed to wield this kind of power. I'm not really sure what the right solution is.

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#197

Post by kayo_20211030 »

dgellow wrote: post #158
kayo_20211030 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that's true. At least not in the European countries I visit.

It’s a EU wide requirement

I dunno. I can go to Tesco in Ireland and the UK (fine, UK is not EU no more, but still Europe) and get a sim without ID.

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#198

Post by ChoGGi »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #137
mcmcmc wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the specific proposed rule to reference: https://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-seeks-comment-enhanced-know...

What I find most concerning is that this isn't a bill or law. Unelected government officials at the FCC can apparently just decide to do this .

You want to have to vote for every single decision maker in the government?

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#199

Post by deadbabe »

t1234s wrote: post #113

This is probably part of the larger scope of the system wanting to require ID to even boot a computer let alone connect to the internet.

More than that, a ban on all general purpose computing.

You can only use specific applications downloaded from walled gardens. You cannot write and execute arbitrary code.

If you are an engineer, all code must be generated via LLM and it passes through some verification through a centralized security and compliance authority on the way to you. You must be fully licensed.

This will be, the end of malware.

Re: FCC wants to kill burner phones by forcing telecoms to get all customers' IDs

#200

Post by [deleted] »

ChoGGi wrote: post #198
Ajedi32 wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I find most concerning is that this isn't a bill or law. Unelected government officials at the FCC can apparently just decide to do this .

You want to have to vote for every single decision maker in the government?

[deleted]
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