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Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

reuters.com

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Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#331

Post by flaunf221 »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #79

I understand Apple's position on this one. This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data. It is also a very useful feature. The EU regulators are disallowing guardrails without which this backdoor will be used to strip-mine people's personal data. The privacy implications are not legible to most people. If I was more cynical I would suggest that this is being used as an end-run around encryption, since the enc…

> This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data.

This is the rhetoric used against right to repair. "What if enemies get access to our citizens' data if we allow anyone but us to repair your car?"

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#332

Post by jen20 »

andix wrote: post #253

It's totally fine that Apple doesn't release this feature for EU customers. If they think they can still sell enough phones it's also fine I guess. What's not fine, is to blame the EU for the missing feature. It's damaging their brand and damaging their reputation. Just think about if Porsche would make a press release and calling the US tariffs "un-American". Wouldn't be perceived well either.

> Just think about if Porsche would make a press release and calling the US tariffs "un-American".

Like this? https://www.thestreet.com/automotive/bmw-ceo-has-blunt-new-m...

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#335

Post by happyopossum »

graphime wrote: post #3

Good. EU has the right to privacy. Apple also has the right to not conduct business in EU. If EU doesn’t like it, they can build their own sovereign software.

> EU has the right to privacy.

Sure - the DMA has nothing to do with privacy though, so that's a straw man. or is it a red herring? I always get those confused.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#336

Post by microtonal »

MBCook wrote: post #290
microtonal wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple Intelligence was announced at WWDC two years ago, they had plenty of time to work on interoperability. Besides that: access to all of your messages, photos, what's on your screen, browsing history, etc. Apple says hey so we're going to need some time to figure out if we can do that in a way that won't completely fuck over our users. The point is that if Apple's model gets all that access, they should give other…

> The point is that if Apple's model gets all that access, they should give others access to those APIs as well, otherwise they are giving themselves benefits over the competition Yes. They SHOULD. So how did they do that without throwing away their privacy promise or running afoul of the privacy laws?

First, LLM providers providing their services to European customers are bound to European privacy laws (GDPR) as well. If third-party providers violate the GDPR, it is not Apple's problem. Just like it's not the problem of Debian if you run Claude Code and Claude Code decides to upload your whole life (even though the OS provides the APIs to read the files).

Second, they could provide users with permission toggles of what users want to share and what not. Same as iOS/Android do now for contacts, location access, etc.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#337

Post by superxpro12 »

flaunf221 wrote: post #331
jandrewrogers wrote: post #79

I understand Apple's position on this one. This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data. It is also a very useful feature. The EU regulators are disallowing guardrails without which this backdoor will be used to strip-mine people's personal data. The privacy implications are not legible to most people. If I was more cynical I would suggest that this is being used as an end-run around encryption, since the enc…

> This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data. This is the rhetoric used against right to repair. "What if enemies get access to our citizens' data if we allow anyone but us to repair your car?"

The hypocrisy is easily explained by the overall attack on ownership... you dont own your own data. you dont own your car, your phone, your pc. Everyone wants to own all your stuff...

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#338

Post by slekker »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #319
burnte wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not as if Apple doesn't have the money to dedicate a team to matching the EU's requirements on a deadline. They just choose not to. Exactly, that's actually why I LIKE this decision so much. I'm not on Apple's side, but I REALLY like the idea that a company just says, "Fine, we'll comply by not even offering this product." It's a perfectly legitimate choice, and it FORCED Apple to evaluate the pros and cons. I…

Yes, exactly! Also forced EU voters to consider how much they value these services, and whether the regulations are worth it not to have them, or to have watered down versions of them. I say this without judgment - I see it as a legitimate area of consideration. I think the worst is hugely impactful laws for which exceptions are constantly carved out so nobody can truly evaluate whether the law/reg is a good one or n…

I value them a lot, happy that the EU didnt bend down to Apple.

If it werent for the EU, the companies would get away with all sorts of shit.

Is as if people forget companies are evil by nature and will fuck you any chance they get.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#339

Post by alt227 »

bnj wrote: post #44
FinnKuhn wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't have anything to do with privacy. The DMA mandates that Apple allows for competition, which (if you believe in capitalism) is good for the market overall. It's essential to stop big tech from abusing their market dominance. However Apple would prefer to not allow competition for their digital products on any of their hardware.

But that does have to do with privacy. Apple wants to implement features that access data locally. It doesn’t want to allow competition for offering those features, but if it did, competitors may use that access to local data to exfiltrate. So it is about both competition and, as a result of creating competition, privacy.

Thats what Apple wants you to think. In reality it has nothing to do with privacy. Apple could let 3rd parties tap into these APIs but only after the user clicks away a big scary message telling the user they are leaving the comfort of the apple curated garden.

This allows competition, but also allows privacy for those who want it. See? Simple really, but Apple being Apple dont want to let 3rd parties use its AI APIs and so we have this standoff.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#340

Post by nonethewiser »

graphime wrote: post #3

Good. EU has the right to privacy. Apple also has the right to not conduct business in EU. If EU doesn’t like it, they can build their own sovereign software.

Why would the EU want an EU company to make a phone OS with a massive privacy flaw?
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