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Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

reuters.com

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Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#231

Post by MBCook »

necovek wrote: post #182
aeontech wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lemma 1: you want to protect your users privacy, and are also beholden to regulation enforcing that commitment (GDPR). Lemma 2: you are obliged by other regulation to offer equal access to user data to third parties, so others can build equivalent functionality (DMA). Lemma 3: malicious third parties will absolutely try to abuse the access and trick the user into sharing their data by all means possible. You will be…

I am not sure this is as much of a tension as you make it sound: where is the obligation that a marketplace administrator will be blamed for any and all breaches of data privacy trust from a participating (likely malicious) third party? According to GDPR, the app developer is the "data controller" and thus ultimately responsible. Only in the case where Apple knowingly participated in unlawful behavior is it likely to…

But this isn’t a normal app. Apple is the one handing over all the data to the AI service.

Couldn’t someone argue that they “knowingly participated“? Do you think they want that risk?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#232

Post by stonegray »

a2128 wrote: post #8

In a circle of irony, reuters.com is denying my request to read the article about Apple deciding to deny rolling out Siri in EU due to being denied their request for an exemption to law Access Denied Our apologies, the content you requested cannot be accessed.

[this comment is not available to readers in the EU in compliance with EU law]

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#233

Post by AndroTux »

nromiun wrote: post #43

Apple stock is down more than 4% right now. That is a big dump for such a blue chip stock. IDK if it is due to this EU ban or Apple choice of going with Gemini (instead of making their own models).

If the market is reacting to the Gemini news now, something is wrong. This has been a known fact for months.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#235

Post by 3683826312819 »

callc wrote: post #145
nsikorr wrote: post #30

Good for the total of eight users that will then use an alternative agent once it landed. Similar to the twelve people that use alternative app stores.

Why make fun of freedom? Have some dignity. We all deserve the right to fully own our general compute devices.

[dead]

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#236

Post by seanmcdirmid »

square_usual wrote: post #220
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s fair. Apple bickers in the EU and U.S. It doesn’t in China. I have a clear preference for one set of political systems.

They aren't releasing it in China either.

Yet. But they are probably working with Chinese partners (including the government) on releasing something (maybe with Alibaba models instead of Google models, on a Chinese-local cloud rather than google cloud).

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#237

Post by miken123 »

jonhohle wrote: post #224
ornornor wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay? I don’t see the problem, these requirements are known from the beginning so if complying wasn’t planned and requires re-architecturing the software to make it happens that’s on the engineering org not on the EU regulator. Unless I’m missing something?

These are relatively recent and may have come into force after development began, definitely after Siri development an initial integration into personal data. I suppose if you think these rules are reasonable, you’d be happy to not have this functionality. The rest of the world will be happy to not allow third parties access to our data. As a small developer, the cost to support something like this would be so overwh…

> As a small developer, the cost to support something like this would be so overwhelming I wouldn’t consider supporting the EU officially.

As a small developer, you wouldn't fall under the DMA.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#238

Post by andix »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #79

I understand Apple's position on this one. This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data. It is also a very useful feature. The EU regulators are disallowing guardrails without which this backdoor will be used to strip-mine people's personal data. The privacy implications are not legible to most people. If I was more cynical I would suggest that this is being used as an end-run around encryption, since the enc…

> This is essentially a backdoor into all of your data.

No. Only if you would consider the Linux/macos/windows filesystem API a backdoor too. On your desktop any app with sufficient permissions can read all your data. Would you call that a backdoor?

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#239

Post by FinnKuhn »

theshrike79 wrote: post #205
FinnKuhn wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is using Cloud compute as well to enable Siri AI. If you want to you could still use Apple or another provider you decide to trust - or even one that does everything locally. The competition would still have to follow GDPR after all.

Apple PCC has been independently audited to be ultra secure. Will the EU enforce the same for 3rd party integrations?

If Apple had e.g. required competitors to undergo similar independent audits that would probably be allowed as it is quite similar to how Apple solved the third party app store issue.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#240

Post by yandie »

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #125
yandie wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Appples architecture prevents them from seeing customers data (see Private Cloud Compute documentation). Data that Gemini Assistant (not referring to the distilled version Apple uses) see goes straight to Google. Big difference here. Weird to say it but the only assistant with any guarantee for privacy by design is Siri at the moment.

> Data that Gemini see goes straight to Google. That's not how the deal was announced. You don't pay Bs / year for a licence to gemini to send them your data. You pay that to run it on your own hardware, in your own garden, so the data stays put. I know the internet is always anti big companies, but this is likely a "not worth it for now, we'll eventually do it" effort from Apple. The EU AI act is a mess, and the eff…

I was referring to Google Gemini AI (their branding is horrible) - Google can see ALL of your interactions with their services - that's not what Apple gets to see

https://security.apple.com/blog/private-cloud-compute/

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