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Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

reuters.com

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Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#171

Post by krzyk »

necovek wrote: post #107
bnj wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I follow the situation, it seems that regulatory uncertainty is a major issue though- the EU’s requirements are framed in terms of outcomes sought, rather than in terms that can be quantitatively shown as met or broken. So it’s not a matter of dedicating a team to meet a list of requirements, but instead navigating the worst case scenario of enforcement if post-launch the EU determines that the proscribed outcomes…

In this case it looks much simpler: Apple strictly does not want to open up the iOS platform to other competing agents, as they lose the monopolistic moat if they do. While making a true developer platform with good documentation is often hard and expensive, with the market access they'd get, companies would gladly jump on it even if it was badly documented as long as they have guarantees of continued legal access. A…

Yeah, Siri was such a poor solution compared to Google (and Google's is also poor in EU) that no one would make a campaign.

If Siri wants to be seen as anything it should first support every EU language and they can work from there.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#172

Post by simjnd »

gorbypark wrote: post #94
joshuat wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From past experience, it is when you are physically in the EU, but this implementation could obviously differ from how they've gated features in the past.

I have the complete opposite experience. Originally had a Canadian bought iPhone in Spain, had all the features a Canadian has and a European doesn’t (or vice versa). Upgraded to a Spanish bought iPhone and I am still a “Canadian”. I’ve been here for nearly 5 years but my Apple account is still fully Canadian (Canadian address, Canadian credit card on file). I think it’s Apple account location, maybe with some sort o…

I have a European account, when I lived in Japan I could use all the features (iPhone Mirroring, etc.) that are blocked in the EU. When back in the EU I can still use them for about 2 weeks before they get blocked again.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#173

Post by JumpCrisscross »

ErneX wrote: post #119

It would be nice if Europe had companies innovating at this level but it’s not happening. If you make a list of tentative companies that would integrate their stuff to the OS like Siri it’s very likely all those are major US companies, so I don’t even know at this point what the EU is trying to defend here. All I know is we are buying the same devices designed by the US but keep increasing the list of features we can…

> If you make a list of tentative companies that would integrate their stuff to the OS like Siri it’s very likely all those are major US companies

Mistral. I’d bet my bottom dollar that the French are the reason the EU is holding firm on its position.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#174

Post by dgellow »

naturalmovement wrote: post #133

What is the countdown to Germans outraged when someone from outside the EU is walking down the street and catches a fleeting audio clip of them which is processed by Apple's AI? Does this mean the service will not be available to EU accounts , or will they geoblock access from within the EU altogether?

For context, under German law recording spoken words without consent is illegal. There is some nuances when speaking in public loud enough for strangers around to hear though

https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_stgb/englisch_st...

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#175

Post by necovek »

kube-system wrote: post #129
spwa4 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean they wanted there to be no confusion whatsoever that they wouldn't allow competition in their ecosystem.

The exemption requested was temporary.

EU response said it was "for a minimum of 18 months" — does not sound temporary to me.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#176

Post by JumpCrisscross »

simjnd wrote: post #159
inglor_cz wrote: post #136

There is a widespread expectation here in the EU that every vendor in the world wants to access the common market and thus will accept any regulations and limitations that come with it. Given that our share of global GDP has dropped from 25 to 17 per cent in twenty years, with a steady downward trend, I am not convinced that this principle will hold for much longer, and this case of Siri may be one of the canaries in…

> Europe accounted for nearly 27% of Apple's total sales in its last fiscal year I don't know about every vendor, but Apple probably doesn't want to lose 27% of their sales.

> Apple probably doesn't want to lose 27% of their sales

They’re not going to over a single unproven feature.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#177

Post by Forgeties79 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #135
Forgeties79 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine complying with all kinds of laws and regulations slows releases in some way or another and having none of them would allow people to ship faster, so what makes these EU regulations so distinct? Do what you have to do to comply with the law and release, as always.

> complying with all kinds of laws delays release in some way or another and having none of them would allow people to ship faster, so what makes these EU regulations so distinct? DMA was designed to be a comprehensive regulatory suite. Lawmakers knew it would be onerous; that’s why it only applies to large companies. Also, the DMA’s interoperability requirement creates external partners. Let’s face it, Apple’s track…

No one complains (out loud) about US regulations either. Ultimately it’s about the weight you can throw as well as PR. Probably easier for Apple to make the EU look bad and drag their feet on it. I imagine they’re still not thrilled about the Lightening->USB-C change

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#178

Post by JumpCrisscross »

Forgeties79 wrote: post #177
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> complying with all kinds of laws delays release in some way or another and having none of them would allow people to ship faster, so what makes these EU regulations so distinct? DMA was designed to be a comprehensive regulatory suite. Lawmakers knew it would be onerous; that’s why it only applies to large companies. Also, the DMA’s interoperability requirement creates external partners. Let’s face it, Apple’s track…

No one complains (out loud) about US regulations either. Ultimately it’s about the weight you can throw as well as PR. Probably easier for Apple to make the EU look bad and drag their feet on it. I imagine they’re still not thrilled about the Lightening->USB-C change

> No one complains (out loud) about US regulations either

Everyone constantly does!

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#179

Post by JumpCrisscross »

jefftk wrote: post #142
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you knew the restrictions day one you’d be able to engineer the system to accommodate them This slows down deploying the system globally. Particularly if the target is moving, it may make sense to build lightly so one can pivot, and then build in the compliance stuff after you know you have a winning configuration. The EU has its laws. Apple has its strategy. The only thing I fault anyone on is the public bicker…

Laws and strategy are not fixed, and public bickering is part of how they get optimized.

That’s fair. Apple bickers in the EU and U.S. It doesn’t in China. I have a clear preference for one set of political systems.

Re: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption

#180

Post by eigencoder »

jwr wrote: post #110

What does it even mean to "roll out in EU"? These concepts are so outdated it's not even funny. Let's say I have several citizenships, live mostly in the EU, but currently stay in Japan, do I get the features or not? Like app store regional gating and DVD regions, these restrictions are dinosaurs of the past.

I mean, borders still exist, and laws apply within borders. I don't believe that national (or supra-national in the EU's case) sovereignty is yet a dinosaur of the past.
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