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MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

mimo.xiaomi.com

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Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#71

Post by solenoid0937 »

cdata wrote: post #68
alkyon wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like exponential growth of crappy software. I'm not saying that before we didn't have mass produced crap in SE, but now it will turn into explosive overflow.

We are living in a ZIRP-like era where builders at the fastest pace layer have misattributed their velocity to exponential gains in model capability. In fact, they are surfing on decades of careful effort to build a robust foundation of highly reusable software libraries. This strategy will seem to work really well until the economy that enabled that foundation to form is hollowed out. Then, there will be a reckoning…

> This strategy will seem to work really well until the economy that enabled that foundation to form is hollowed out. Then, there will be a reckoning (but we will have no choice but to march forth from there).

There will only be a reckoning if models don't get much better.

If they do get much better you can just have them refactor, fix bugs in, or replace the existing codebase.

The concept of tech debt is sort of meaningless if you anticipate intelligence gains in models to continue.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#72

Post by ignoramous »

miroljub wrote: post #61
kingstnap wrote: post #13

Given that MiMo is as cheap as Deepseek ( previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48282814 ) multiplying that by 3x for ultra speed is still shockingly cheap.

MiMo and DeepSeek are not cheap. Anthropic and OpenAI are expensive for what they provide.

The Chinese "Neijuan" is real & well reported: https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/what-i...

It is another thing the BigLabs accuse open weight models of benefiting from distillation & other techniques & essentially avoid higher training costs (which typically bleed into bills end users pay for inference).

Ex A: https://www.anthropic.com/research/2028-ai-leadership

Ex B: https://www.reuters.com/world/china/openai-accuses-deepseek-...

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#73

Post by throwaway67678 »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #39
amunozo wrote: post #17

These price and speed optimization from Chinese providers, combined with the raising prices from American ones will change the game sooner than later. Many companies are finding issues with the AI bills already.

I wonder what are the economics driving these pricing decisions? Are the Chinese companies just subsidizing their models to a greater degree than the US, or is this an emergent property of energy policy between countries?

Lower cost of labor, lots of under the hood optimizations (e.g. cache hits for DS), many of these companies have existing infra (fewer upfront costs for deployment), etc

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#74

Post by slaw »

irthomasthomas wrote: post #11

I don't understand, given all they say, why this would not be made available to everyone at once? Why the limited release? They should have no trouble scaling it if it runs on a single rack.

Chinese companies are blocked from buying modern ASML lithography machines. The most modern scanner China is still allowed to buy is NXT:1980i from 2015.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#75

Post by lostmsu »

scosman wrote: post #19

Cerebras is trialing Kimi K2.6 at 3000t/s (invite only). I'm excited for when the fast hardware gets more mainstream for frontier models. Models designed for speed on Nvidia are nice addition that could bridge the gap.

Cerebras currently does not provide any discounts for prefix caching making its use for agentic workloads sqr(n_turns) more expensive.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#76

Post by kypro »

amunozo wrote: post #17

These price and speed optimization from Chinese providers, combined with the raising prices from American ones will change the game sooner than later. Many companies are finding issues with the AI bills already.

Another problem is that US models are all closed source, and if you're a large corporate you may not want your org to be held hostage by OpenAI / Anthropic.

I genuinely don't understand what moat these US model labs have. If they're saying recursive self improvement is just around the corner and Chinese labs are only slightly behind the leading US models, what moat does the US labs have? Are the US models going to recursively self improve better than the Chinese open source ones or something?

I might be completely wrong about this, but if I had money in OpenAI or Anthropic I'd be pulling it all right now. I think the chance of them going to near-zero over the next few years is very significant.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#77

Post by sidrag22 »

harel wrote: post #36

A few things in life I can't fully grasp why they are so sought after. One is that constant need to exhibit growth. As if being massive and staying as massive is not good enough, one has to always and continuously grow. The other is constant speed increases. We're already operating at 50x speed. My output is much wider and so much faster, I am sometimes my own bottleneck. And now as if that is not enough we want more…

different use cases for different people. some people are nurturing a code base and ensuring it doesnt become a gross mess so they become the bottleneck. some people are just trying to prompt stuff into existence and dont know what sql is.

I think this site often overlooks that second group and how large it likely is.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#78

Post by ketzo »

ipkstef wrote: post #65
goyozi wrote: post #58

Fast AI seems genuinely exciting and somewhat unsettling to me. Right now Claude is faster than me on some tasks but we’re at least close. I have a prompt to clean up a PR that’s been running for 1h now and I expect it to take another few. It’s hard to imagine how the workflow would look like if it was near-instant. On the one hand, it might be easier to focus. Some prompts take so long that I start to multitask and…

asking for curiosities sake. What kind of PR loop are you running that takes a few hours?

not OP but usually for me this means long verification loop; waiting 10min on CI checks, that kind of thing, rather than actual 1hr wall clock of token generation

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#79

Post by vitalyan1234 »

alkyon wrote: post #44
serpix wrote: post #16

I may sound like a shill, but exponential growth and all. We are going to get near instant software from prompt, multiple ones and then choose the best one. Discussions about choosing a library with the best syntactic sugar method naming is just as crazy as suggesting we type in assembly.

Sounds like exponential growth of crappy software. I'm not saying that before we didn't have mass produced crap in SE, but now it will turn into explosive overflow.

"exponential growth of crappy X" applies to every industry that went from being an artisanal craft to being mass produced with little or no human input. and we live much better lives than we did before the industrial revolution.

Re: MiMo-v2.5-Pro-UltraSpeed: 1T model with 1000 tokens per second

#80

Post by asveikau »

9cb14c1ec0 wrote: post #31
serpix wrote: post #16

I may sound like a shill, but exponential growth and all. We are going to get near instant software from prompt, multiple ones and then choose the best one. Discussions about choosing a library with the best syntactic sugar method naming is just as crazy as suggesting we type in assembly.

Anyone remember the old days when a new frontend framework came out every 3 months. That has pretty much stopped. No one cares anymore.

> when a new frontend framework came out every 3 months.

> No one cares anymore.

I never cared about this.

I think this captures something that I've been searching for the words for. (Maybe I should have gotten an LLM to write the words for me.) Some of the biggest AI boosters are the kind of dev that would have cared about the new frameworks of the last 3 months. They had a "the framework does all the thinking for me" attitude already, so it is easy for AI to slot into that.

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