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Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

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Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm guessing they are referring to a certain synonym for idiot/moron/imbecile/cretin/dolt/etc. which fell off the euphemistic treadmill

That would be the “Linus Sebastian misconception”

Ok, but I can't possibly be the only one who has no idea who that is, let alone what misconceptions they have.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#132

I think what we’re seeing here isnt Valve messing up but rather the middle east conflict expanded to cyberspace and spilling over to impact civilians. Look at the timing and affected countries. China isnt also exactly known for free internet. WebRTC works as fallback. WebRTC is encrypted and cant be used for much else. STUN in the otherhand is unencrypted and the protocol itself can be used for DDoS reflection/amplif…

[flagged]

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#133

My unpopular opinion: Valve is basically a parasite or a landlord. They've been so successful it's hard to imagine a world without them, and they say "you gotta give the parasite its due" and we believe them and comply. It's been kept around because they treat their customers ok, but they absolutely exsanguinate their developers. And their engineering culture is... odd. They hire senior people and then let them all f…

Developers, like gamers, are the most oppressed people.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#134
post #60

I think what we’re seeing here isnt Valve messing up but rather the middle east conflict expanded to cyberspace and spilling over to impact civilians. Look at the timing and affected countries. China isnt also exactly known for free internet. WebRTC works as fallback. WebRTC is encrypted and cant be used for much else. STUN in the otherhand is unencrypted and the protocol itself can be used for DDoS reflection/amplif…

STUN/TURN is basically icanhazip for WebRTC. STUN gives you your public IP:port. TURN is the same, but the returned IP:port is the one that had been dynamically allocated to you at time of querying, rather than the actual ones. WebRTC clients take that STUN/TURN response and send to peers through out-of-band, through e.g. a lobby server chat mechanism, to set up the connection. This allows NAT table entries to be cre…

> TURN is the same, but the returned IP:port is the one that had been dynamically allocated to you at time of querying, rather than the actual ones.

I don't know you mean by this, but I think you're confused. I have implemented STUN, so I know how it works. AFAIK, TURN doesn't reveal an address/port any different from that revealed by STUN, and cannot, because its discovery feature is STUN. (Also, a typical home user has only one internet-facing address, not a dynamic one plus another one.)

Rather, TURN provides a STUN address/port discovery service and a data relay service. The relay is for cases where two peers wishing to connect are both behind difficult NAT, meaning there is no quick and reliable way for them to directly connect even when they have their STUN results. So instead of connecting directly, they communicate through the relay.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#135
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam is also a child gambling company that sells loot boxes to kids but it could be a lot worse. From the perspective of someone getting ripped off it doesn't matter whether it was Gaben who scammed you, but he and his empire could still be a lot worse overall. You're allowed to say what you just said in that post without getting taken away at night and your family never talking about you again. Or a drone taking yo…

> You're allowed to say what you just said in that post without getting taken away at night and your family never talking about you again. Or a drone taking you out while you sleep. Palantir logs all our comments and it would be trivially easy for them if there weren't still some lingering democratic handrails holding them back. I don't live in the US. The US is not going to start a war with my country to kill some r…

Now you're just straw manning, and misrepresenting history, Kent State led to a huge increase in protests and troop mutinies which forced the US to leave Vietnam. If the US was fascist it would have sent tanks into the streets and dropped nukes.

Also misquoting me at the end, my point is you must be connected to the global tech economy which is still dominated by US capital, but go on and larp if you want.

You assumed I'm American I can assume you are too. Your manufactured fatalist narrative seems to suggest people to larp instead of using democratic methods to resist the far right, that thinking has been been heavily pushed by the elites on social media in the US to discredit and disorganize the left.

I think we're also historically lucky that China is ruled by the CPC, whatever you dislike about them it could be much worse, a few historical accidents going differently and it could just as easily be a Han fascist government invading all its neighbors. Be grateful for what you have before it's gone. Steam is one of the last unshittified apps remaining in existence.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#136
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You are factually incorrect" is not moving the goalposts. Shifting to a completely unrelated argument is moving the goalposts because you can't stand to be wrong.

etiam's right that "in Israel and possibly other middle east countries" wouldn't fit onto the HN title, which is relevant to raincole's clickbait accusation. The original Github issue title fits, but that doesn't specify "Valve" or the timeframe. Not that it'd be particularly hard to reword to fit all information. Feel like things are getting unnecessarily agitated ("You've been here long enough to understand", "you…

I can only assume that mob of fresh accounts is sockpuppets meant precisely for trying to stir up conflict and detract from discussion of the actual topics raised by a story like this. Sorry if I accidentally gave them opportunity for more oxygen than necessary.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#137
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just tested it. Copied&pasted the original title into submit form. Nope. Right within the limit.

[flagged]

Your hostility isn't helping things either. "You've been here long enough to understand" followed by an incorrect usage of "goal post moving" makes you look like an agitator.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lack an informed opinion on the matter but I have to wonder what you think the one thing has to do with the other? Developers have very little choice but to go where the customers are.

Why aren't the customers going to Epic Game Store? It's the PC, after all. It's explicitly not a walled garden

EGS has yet to reach the feaure parity of Steam from 15 years ago.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#139
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're allowed to say what you just said in that post without getting taken away at night and your family never talking about you again. Or a drone taking you out while you sleep. Palantir logs all our comments and it would be trivially easy for them if there weren't still some lingering democratic handrails holding them back. I don't live in the US. The US is not going to start a war with my country to kill some r…

Now you're just straw manning, and misrepresenting history, Kent State led to a huge increase in protests and troop mutinies which forced the US to leave Vietnam. If the US was fascist it would have sent tanks into the streets and dropped nukes. Also misquoting me at the end, my point is you must be connected to the global tech economy which is still dominated by US capital, but go on and larp if you want. You assume…

> Kent State led to a huge increase in protests and troop mutinies which forced the US to leave Vietnam.

This is not my understanding of the matter. Apparently only 11% of Americans were in support of the students, with the majority supporting the troops. Granted, my source for this is the Wikipedia article, which I am well aware of the deficiencies of. If you have recommended reading that suggests Kent State was significantly influential on the outcome of future protests and US withdrawal, I'm open to it.

> my point is you must be connected to the global tech economy which is still dominated by US capital

I work for a bootstrapped Turkish startup with no outside capital, American or otherwise, but try again :) or is America, center of the universe as it is, responsible for the existence of all tech economies everywhere?

> Your manufactured fatalist narrative seems to suggest people to larp instead of using democratic methods to resist the far right,

Uh, my what? What? I'm simply disputing the irritating claim that we're oh-so-lucky to have had benevolent American overlords and how it could've been much worse. I honestly don't know if it could've been much worse. At a certain threshold of outright evilness, you get the entire world uniting against you, as Germany saw. America manages to perfectly straddle the line such that it can be the most optimally amount of evil and still get away with it unchecked for centuries. Internally, it committed the degree of atrocities that inspired the Nazis -- Lebensraum is rebranded Manifest Destiny, and the Jim Crow laws were studied as the blueprint for by-the-books legalised discrimination against Jews, but externally, it managed diplomacy much better, conducting just the right frequency of invasions with just the right propaganda massaging not to find itself at war with everyone at once.

For whatever it's worth, I agree that we're lucky to have Valve/Steam for all its faults. It is a flawed company that could be much worse. I don't know why you felt the need to relate it to America.

Re: Major P2P issues in Israel and possibly other Middle East countries

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be the “Linus Sebastian misconception”

Ok, but I can't possibly be the only one who has no idea who that is, let alone what misconceptions they have.

There is a thing called Google, "Linus Sebastian Hard R" is full of information.
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