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Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

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41–50 of 89 posts

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#41

Is he headline strictly about subsidized subscriptions? Anthropic announced their first profitable quarter.

Anthropic is absolutely not profitable on a GAAP basis.

Companies may state cash flow positive, operating profit, EBITDA positive, but this is not a true profit in aggregate, just when stripping out many other expenses.

If anyone has evidence to the contrary, please share. Once they go public it will all be free to review, at least.

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#42

That’s probably because only a handful of companies manufacture GPUs, and they’re still expensive. I think that will change over time as competition increases. LLMs are also still in a relatively early stage. We’re already seeing models become both smaller and more capable—for example, GPT-4 compared to Qwen3-30B, which can outperform GPT-4 in many tasks while using significantly less compute. So if this trend contin…

Not to mention the rise of Chinese chips. GPUs that can run everything from Crysis to CUDA are a harder engineering problem to solve than creating a chip that's optimized for inference. Not to mention that inference is an excellent first step towards a full, competitive GPU as well.

Which chips are these? It seems the main challenge is data bus speed and memory capacity now and it seems no one can really compete with NVIDIA now? And i doubt NVIDIA is still optimizing for anything expect LLMs/AI, their last keynote had less than two minutes of gaming related content and they even canceled their new generation of gaming cards for now.

And it seems all of these advanced chips rely on the most advanced lithography which is tightly guarded and supply locked by a few companies.

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#43
post #22
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes this is what I"m waiting for. I do hope these cards will not come with any kind of vendor locking though.

What kind of vendor locking would be possible?

Any kind really. If Apple can lock down the CPU of an iPhone, then I'm sure it is possible to lock down an LLM chip. The business model may then be that you can buy certain "agent apps" and run them on your LLM card. But I have to stop here because I don't want to give anyone any ideas though I'm sure they are "creative" enough.

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#44
post #37
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole premise of what's being described here is to bake the weights into the silicon. That isn't what I'd describe as vendor lock-in, any more than I'd describe a CPU that can only execute ARM instructions as vendor locked. To answer my own question, I bet they could figure out a way to still bill you per-token, if they wanted to.

Portability between x86 and ARM is not a form of vendor lock? And of course they could bill per-token, same way cable PPV worked (the bits were already in your house). But the cost structure of weights in silicon means that competitors would be encouraged to compete on this per-token cost, as their marginal cost would be zero. I don’t see that being a durable business model, but I guess the counter argument is it’s a…

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Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#45
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you share some use cases of what you think will get companies to become hooked? I'm really failing to see a dependency link emerging either now or in the future. That combined with the relatively easy switching costs. It doesn't bode well for AI companies seeking to create a walled garden.

Teachers in public schools are being told to use AI in their curriculum. In some cases, this means students are being taught not to think (regardless of the intent of the lesson). When prices make this curriculum untenable but the kids already depend on it, that rugpull is going to severely harm a generation of kids whose education was already disturbed in 2020.

Good lord! Where is this happening? Why would anybody think this was a good idea?

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#46
Anthropic and openai has the most efficient tokens per unit of compute on the planet and honestly that's their current moat. They're able to serve tokens at half the cost of any opensource provider. Here's the costs to serve opus 4.7 in china on aws according to one of my connections that operates an enterprise account in the region:

  Input: $0.257
  Output: $1.286
  Cache read: $0.0257
  Cache write: $0.322
And I have zero doubts that using batching and other optimizations that subscription users are being served at an even lower cost. Most of their expenses likely come from training as we're far into the diminishing returns terriority. We will know once anthropic is required by law to report these numbers so there's no point in continued speculation that "anthropic is losing $9 for every $1" because 1: unless there's some subsidies going on it's not true and 2: we will be told directly from anthropic what the numbers are in the near future.

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#47
post #2

If this is the true cost of AI then the future might be dedicated extension cards for computers that hardcode entire models + weights. Downside: you need to buy a new one for each model. Upside: insanely fast inference and zero subscription cost, only one time purchase cost. Once a certain open source model gets good enough this might become viable. Right now the landscape is still shifting too fast. State of the art…

Or someone works out a hardware architecture that's optimized for AI inference in the way you describe, but also good for 3D graphics.

That would fuse 3D graphics and AI accelerators into 1 and the same unit, as far as consumer hardware is concerned.

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#49
I see combined estimated revenue for Q1/2026 to be $15B to $20B, depending on source. I also see combined estimated spend Q1/2026 at $15 to $20B, depending on source.

Someone or something is having an hallucination that would make an AI jealous

Re: Anthropic/OpenAI may be spending more than $1000 for every $100 you pay them

#50
post #2

If this is the true cost of AI then the future might be dedicated extension cards for computers that hardcode entire models + weights. Downside: you need to buy a new one for each model. Upside: insanely fast inference and zero subscription cost, only one time purchase cost. Once a certain open source model gets good enough this might become viable. Right now the landscape is still shifting too fast. State of the art…

If local AI can make financial sense, then cloud AI will make even more financial sense - an AI card can serve a number of users simultaneously, can be utilized 24x7 instead of however many hours per week you use it, and has other improved efficiencies at scale. Cloud offerings with privacy and security controls will be available for those who want it, just like non-AI cloud offerings with security/privacy options are available today.
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