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Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

arxiv.org

61–70 of 98 posts

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#61

Tokenomics is already a word used to describe cryptocurrency economics, not sure why they'd try to redefine it for AI even if a different sort of token is used.

cryptocurrency economics = cryptonomics You're welcome! =)

Neal Stephenson wrote a book about it.

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#62

I have a MA system setup for personal use. You give it a problem, you then refine that problem where a fast, cheaper model asks you questions which you answer to get a better input prompt. You then choose a MA strategy for example take problem break up to sections then final judge concludes or you do multi turn where agents debate then judge summarises debate. The best approach is what I call 'all angles' where all t…

You mention cost in one of the replies. Can you elaborate on the cost profile (ballpark) for various problem types? I would also be curious to understand the strategies employed and what the costs look like across each.

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#63
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And AWS heavily pushes a complex lambda solution stringing together as many chargeable AWS services as possible for a simple requirement Their interests are often not your interests. In this case they want you to unnecessary money on useless work (let's stop the euphemism of "tokens" btw)

This kind of cute conspiracy theories don’t actually hold true in real life. The companies want to make useful products.

They're all just in it for the love of making customers happy, for sure. Amazon actually donates all their profit to charity. Bez os is currently building a foundation to shift all his wealth to, and he's going to become an alpaca farmer

/s

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#64
post #21

One month I could use Github Copilot fully with no disruptions. The next month, after pricing changes, I’ve run out of tokens in two days. Such drastic changes tell me that pricing of tokens is arbitrary, and AI business is running out of money fast.

The github example is also a bit of an outlier because they made a recent change to their pricing so that's why its such a drastic jump.

Also I mean prices in generally for all things are based on underlying factors, that doesn't make them arbitary (i.e. github executives using a random number generator for token pricing would be arbitary)

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#65

First thought was "only 30 tasks" however the findings map to what I've seen personally: code review consumes majority of tokens

Code review could also be run as an unattended/batched task though, possibly with at least some use of on-prem inference (which excels at this). That would be a major saving compared to the usual cloud inference scenario.

with which models, though?

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#66
post #3

One thing I've noticed using agents for coding is that they really like to write thousands of unit tests but not dynamically test.

you can just tell them to do more dynamic testing. I think dynamic testing is partly frowned upon because it slows things down & can take down software where you wouldn't expect

[deleted]

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what harness are you using? And what LLM’s

Homebrew harness and all frontier ones plus deepseek. All via Openrouter at the moment. Works well enough but can get expensive so use for real high value challenges. Interestingly the refine feature has been most useful to me and people I have shown, essentially people are lazy when expressing the initial problem (me included!), refine asks relevant questions to initial problem then refines the initial statement, us…

I came to a similar conclusion. I think the default options in many IDEs (Ask/Plan/Agent) are limited... 'Refine' feels like an improved 'Plan' in that it doesn't just jump right into building a list of tasks based on the initial prompt, because who knows what sort of flaws or deficiencies were present in the initial prompt! Can't always get everything right in the first try. XP

I don't think a specific harness is even necessary to get a boost from 'Refine'. Even a simple custom agent is portable enough... it's easy enough to take the existing 'Plan' agent definition present in VS Code and tweak it to be 'Refine' instead.

Re: Tokenomics: Quantifying Where Tokens Are Used in Agentic Software Engineering

#70
post #60

I have a MA system setup for personal use. You give it a problem, you then refine that problem where a fast, cheaper model asks you questions which you answer to get a better input prompt. You then choose a MA strategy for example take problem break up to sections then final judge concludes or you do multi turn where agents debate then judge summarises debate. The best approach is what I call 'all angles' where all t…

Definitely interested, would love to see a video :)

Sure let me do that. Can I post this as a ShowHN if its just video? The rules say people need to try out but that will cost me a small fortune :) ...could perhaps post on Github and people can setup the repo themselves with their own Openrouter key if that works. Have never done a ShowHN but would be fun to try it.
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