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Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

mashable.com

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Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#71

Post by elorant »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #64
canpan wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When buying fridge, washing machine, oven etc, when I moved, I told the sales person, I like quality, am not price sensitive, but any device that requires an app or has a camera/mic built in is out of question. Some didn't know how to handle that, being used to sell it as a "good thing".

I have an HP wifi printer, 5820 I think. I haven't signed in to HP, haven't connected the printer to cloud. Same for anything else. I don't see the whole "oh you need firmware update to improve the product". 90% of the time it just works. So what happens if the fridge isn't given internet access ? Or washing machine?

Nothing, they just work as intended. I bought a Fujitsu A/C that supposedly required registering through some app. Never connected it, and I removed the wifi kit at installation. Works like a charm no problem whatsoever.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#72

Post by Terr_ »

canpan wrote: post #56
zootboy wrote: post #6

And this is why "mandatory app to configure" is an instant dealbreaker for me for any piece of hardware. Don't buy crap like this. Force companies to be better.

When buying fridge, washing machine, oven etc, when I moved, I told the sales person, I like quality, am not price sensitive, but any device that requires an app or has a camera/mic built in is out of question. Some didn't know how to handle that, being used to sell it as a "good thing".

XFinity (Comcast) recently sent my parents a new router, and AFAICT there was no way to configure it from a LAN computer.

It required a damn proprietary phone app, which I assume was bouncing commands through the internet.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#73

Post by microtonal »

canpan wrote: post #56
zootboy wrote: post #6

And this is why "mandatory app to configure" is an instant dealbreaker for me for any piece of hardware. Don't buy crap like this. Force companies to be better.

When buying fridge, washing machine, oven etc, when I moved, I told the sales person, I like quality, am not price sensitive, but any device that requires an app or has a camera/mic built in is out of question. Some didn't know how to handle that, being used to sell it as a "good thing".

fridge, washing machine, oven etc, [...] Some didn't know how to handle that

I am surprised, all the European brands like Miele, Siemens, Bosch, etc. household appliances work fine without an app. Most that we have now do have an option to connect to WiFi, we never connected them and they all work fine with good old buttons like it's 1985.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#74

Post by microtonal »

binaryturtle wrote: post #16
zootboy wrote: post #6

And this is why "mandatory app to configure" is an instant dealbreaker for me for any piece of hardware. Don't buy crap like this. Force companies to be better.

If it's a "router" and you can't install a OpenWRT on it, then it's an absolute no-brainer to not to buy it.

For most non-technical people this is irrelevant. Even if the router supported OpenWRT, they wouldn't know how to install it, let alone how to configure it.

Luckily, many (but certainly not all) continental West-European ISPs allow you to lease a Fritz!Box or you can buy one in a store and hook it up [1]. Perfect router/modem for consumers (not too complicated), can be configured through a web interface, and the hardware and software is developed by a German company.

[1] Many European countries have router/modem freedom, so an ISP cannot block you if you want to hook up your own gear. E.g. quite some tech people here use their own XGS-PON fiber ONT or at least their own router + modem.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#75

Post by MrGilbert »

microtonal wrote: post #73
canpan wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When buying fridge, washing machine, oven etc, when I moved, I told the sales person, I like quality, am not price sensitive, but any device that requires an app or has a camera/mic built in is out of question. Some didn't know how to handle that, being used to sell it as a "good thing".

fridge, washing machine, oven etc, [...] Some didn't know how to handle that I am surprised, all the European brands like Miele, Siemens, Bosch, etc. household appliances work fine without an app. Most that we have now do have an option to connect to WiFi, we never connected them and they all work fine with good old buttons like it's 1985.

There is a dishwasher from Bosch, that misses some features if you are not using the App - cost-cutting measures. Jeff Geerling made a video about that:

https://youtu.be/5M_hmwBBPnc

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#76

Post by microtonal »

rycomb wrote: post #36
binaryturtle wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it's a "router" and you can't install a OpenWRT on it, then it's an absolute no-brainer to not to buy it.

I'd suggest buying the OpenWRT One. I've bought a bunch, and I think it's terrific.

The One is nice if you want to support the OpenWrt project, but if you want raw power, the GL.iNet Flint 2 (MT6000) is a much better choice. Faster SoC, 1GB RAM, 8GB storage, one more 2.5 GBe port, twice as fast WiFi 6, and also supports vanilla OpenWrt.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#77

Post by microtonal »

zootboy wrote: post #6

And this is why "mandatory app to configure" is an instant dealbreaker for me for any piece of hardware. Don't buy crap like this. Force companies to be better.

I don't disagree, but it's funny that Apple's AirPort routers, which have been axed almost a decade ago, can still be configured with the AirPort app. Years ago, I temporarily hooked up an old AirPort Extreme to replace a broken router, and it even got an update (probably a security update).

At any rate, I think as much as web vs. app, IMO companies should be forced to support their appliances for a certain time period by law (the EU has rolled out a law to require this for some device types). If it was normal for a router to work for 10 years or a washing machine for 20 years, a vendor should be forced to support it for that amount of time since the last sale.

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#78

Post by bzzzt »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #64
canpan wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When buying fridge, washing machine, oven etc, when I moved, I told the sales person, I like quality, am not price sensitive, but any device that requires an app or has a camera/mic built in is out of question. Some didn't know how to handle that, being used to sell it as a "good thing".

I have an HP wifi printer, 5820 I think. I haven't signed in to HP, haven't connected the printer to cloud. Same for anything else. I don't see the whole "oh you need firmware update to improve the product". 90% of the time it just works. So what happens if the fridge isn't given internet access ? Or washing machine?

> I haven't signed in to HP, haven't connected the printer to cloud.

HP fixed a remote exploit a few years back. Theoretically someone could use your local wifi printer to install a persistent backdoor on your network. In practice HP uses updates to patch leaks in their cartridge protection (the most complicated tech in the printers). And accidentally sometimes bricks printers...

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#79

Post by microtonal »

MrGilbert wrote: post #75
microtonal wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

fridge, washing machine, oven etc, [...] Some didn't know how to handle that I am surprised, all the European brands like Miele, Siemens, Bosch, etc. household appliances work fine without an app. Most that we have now do have an option to connect to WiFi, we never connected them and they all work fine with good old buttons like it's 1985.

There is a dishwasher from Bosch, that misses some features if you are not using the App - cost-cutting measures. Jeff Geerling made a video about that: https://youtu.be/5M_hmwBBPnc

Sad. I will check the next time before buying a Bosch product.

Though my main point is, that it is not hard to find products that work fine without an app. E.g. I just checked the Bosch site and could find many models that support delayed start, etc. with on-device buttons. In fact, the one that I picked somewhat randomly, the primary feature the app adds is that you can start the dishwasher remotely, which is the only feature I'd expect to need an app for.

(I completely believe that some of these manufacturers will also have models where they save on on-device buttons/displays by requiring an app.)

Re: Motorola effectively bricked its entire line of WiFi routers without explanation

#80

Post by kotaKat »

ssl-3 wrote: post #13
criticalfault wrote: post #2

there is an explanation: Motorola is extremely bad at software. opinion based on their support system, correspondence and android updates,

There is no singular Motorola. The company has been spinning off different parts of itself for quite a long time. In 2011/2012, it was divided into different parts. The biggest were Motorola Solutions (mostly focused 2-way radios and related communications infrastructure; stuff commonly used by public safety entities) and Motorola Mobility (mostly cell phones and related stuff). Google bought Motorola Mobility. It ha…

Ah yes, just like that time Kodak licensed their name out to make checks... air purifiers? (Bonus points: their brand licensee on most of that crap is now out of business.)

https://www.kodak.com/en/consumer/page/support/

(Or Memorex electric scooters. That's also an 'okay then...' license...)

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