171–180 of 190 posts
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> Elons datacenters in space are looking smarter and smarter by the day. Where would the heat go?
https://youtu.be/s7Mv_OcBXI8 ⤷ Engineering Constraints of Orbital Space-Based Compute: Heat Rejection and more
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Not really the point. Should we have separate laws for stealing from grocery stores, electronics stores and drug stores because they have different characteristics?
It's exactly the point! Data Centers have a unique capability to damage property, society and the environment. A new aluminum smelter, dirty as they are, wont double your electric bill and will employ far more people than a datacenter (other than ex-marines w/ shoot to kill orders, who works there?)
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Not really the point. Should we have separate laws for stealing from grocery stores, electronics stores and drug stores because they have different characteristics?
It's exactly the point! Data Centers have a unique capability to damage property, society and the environment. A new aluminum smelter, dirty as they are, wont double your electric bill and will employ far more people than a datacenter (other than ex-marines w/ shoot to kill orders, who works there?)
An aluminium smelter uses an immense amount of electricity, requiring about 14,000 kWh per metric ton of aluminium produced. Because it takes so much power—roughly equivalent to powering a mid-sized city like Nashville or Boston—electricity can make up to 40% of the total production cost.
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The mad rush to build datacenters at this unprecedented scale is already wreaking havoc on the consumer economy. The needs of everyday people are far more important than the whims of a few trillion dollar tech companies run by billioinaires.
How are they harming consumers? I would think that consumers would vastly benefit from cheaper software, nearly unlimited cloud storage, lower property taxes. Heck, the next generation of data centers are looking like they will actually be net energy producers. Consumers might not know that they benefit from data centers, but that doesn’t mean that they don’t
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Once construction of a data center has completed, how many jobs will they actually be adding? It reminds me of the people saying that oil pipelines are good for jobs, but that's again only a temporary blip during construction. For data centers, for the sheer size of them, they are massively empty of people.
Those things are cash cows for local municipalities. I don't think that aspect is communicated at all, or at least the media leaves that part out. A town a with a $50M budget can easily have a single large datacenter cover the townsfolk's entire tax bill, and then some. The worst part is the fan noise, but I am sure they can figure that out.
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Nobody is concerned about the quantity of land used by an active datacenter. Local municipalities are having to upgrade municipal infrastructure as a result of these projects -- which wouldn't be too bad, if they can be guaranteed the tax revenue to pay for those things -- and the employer sticks around and maintains their property. But in a bubble, it is foreseeable that many of these properties will go under when t…
> Local municipalities are having to upgrade municipal infrastructure as a result of these projects Then they could pass a law requiring the data centers to pay for these instead of banning them outright, should sort itself out no?
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It's exactly the point! Data Centers have a unique capability to damage property, society and the environment. A new aluminum smelter, dirty as they are, wont double your electric bill and will employ far more people than a datacenter (other than ex-marines w/ shoot to kill orders, who works there?)
I'm in agreement with you on the jobs .. but power draw wise?? An aluminium smelter uses an immense amount of electricity, requiring about 14,000 kWh per metric ton of aluminium produced. Because it takes so much power—roughly equivalent to powering a mid-sized city like Nashville or Boston—electricity can make up to 40% of the total production cost. That's quoted from a google AI summary query, sure - but I've had f…
I chose it as an example because they're crazy power hungry. The other classical examples of high electrical use are NH3 fertilizer plants.
But! We're not building hundreds of Al smelters all across the country. Nor are we building hundreds of NH3 plants.
We should be, seeing how a significant amount of our Al and NH3 is locked in the ME, but alas; we've decided to keep a structural, supply-side inflation that will devastate any family making less than $400k rather than divert capital from the surveillance state and chat bots.
At most, there's a market for two Al and NH3 plants in the country potentially employing thousands of lower middle class folks.
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It's exactly the point! Data Centers have a unique capability to damage property, society and the environment. A new aluminum smelter, dirty as they are, wont double your electric bill and will employ far more people than a datacenter (other than ex-marines w/ shoot to kill orders, who works there?)
So why doesn't the way New York addresses new aluminum smelter businesses apply to new data centers?
1. There's no VC distorted market building hundreds of them. At most two Al or NH3 will ever be built again in this country.
2. We need Al and NH3 in a way that we dont need data centers. Most of the protein in your body comes from synthetic NH3. Al has slashed CO2 emissions in industry.
There's a Middle Eastern fertilizer and Al crisis that's going to devastate our economies. Al and NH3 should have been on-shored 20 years ago.
3. Its already impossible to build NH3 or Al plants in NY due to other regulatory laws that target Al and NH3.
So, NY state in its (/s) infinite wisdom (/s) has realized that New Yorkers need to eat more than it needs to feed a surveillance state.
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So why doesn't the way New York addresses new aluminum smelter businesses apply to new data centers?
Well, let's use discernment. Let's also add NH3 plants since those are also electricity hogs. 1. There's no VC distorted market building hundreds of them. At most two Al or NH3 will ever be built again in this country. 2. We need Al and NH3 in a way that we dont need data centers. Most of the protein in your body comes from synthetic NH3. Al has slashed CO2 emissions in industry. There's a Middle Eastern fertilizer a…
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Well, let's use discernment. Let's also add NH3 plants since those are also electricity hogs. 1. There's no VC distorted market building hundreds of them. At most two Al or NH3 will ever be built again in this country. 2. We need Al and NH3 in a way that we dont need data centers. Most of the protein in your body comes from synthetic NH3. Al has slashed CO2 emissions in industry. There's a Middle Eastern fertilizer a…
That clears things up. You want to use the cudgel of the state's power regarding zoning issues to address ventures which you find morally objectionable in some way.
And your sanctimonious attitude is wrong. This isn't about morality. It's literally about economic devastation being caused by VC's using the violence of the state to eminent domain houses to make right away for power lines, inctease power prices, etc.
Of course, you don't believe corporate socialism is wrong, you just call it free market capitalism. Well go read Rothbard.