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C++: The Documentary

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Re: C++: The Documentary

#171

Post by irishcoffee »

TonyAlicea10 wrote: post #151
criddell wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend to think of the web and the internet as distinct things. For the language of the web I'd probably nominate HTML. For the language of the internet it's a lot less clear to me.

Many browser rendering engines are built in C++, so C++ is parsing the HTML. My general point is that many web/internet techs that web devs interact with have C++ one abstraction level below for actual implementation.

I agree with you, and it amuses me to no end when I (rarely) use Wt to make a simple webpage. C++ to js (very roughly) rendered by c++.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#172

Post by abcd_f »

zeafoamrun wrote: post #7
bdamm wrote: post #2

Since I've been working in C++ a lot recently I decided to watch the video as I waited for a build to complete. So the length is about right. And fortunately, the video is a delight!

I have read as much as I can on the history of C++ and I'm looking forward to watch this. I find the process of it's evolution deeply fascinating.

> the process of it's (sic) evolution deeply fascinating.

... as it is disappointing.

Not everything that can be done should be done.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#173

Post by bluGill »

maccard wrote: post #155
bluGill wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tooling people have - as of about a year ago said they are ready. Now everyone who considers themselves early adopters is using then. Most are waiting for the early adopters to figure out what the best practices are so we don't make a mess

What early adopters are using them? Because my impression is the tooling still isn’t there

CMake says they are there. Other tools mostly are not.

Nobody has said they are using them in anything important, but hopefully that is coming.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#174

Post by randusername »

jdw64 wrote: post #11

It's surprising that C++'s development trend continues. When a game or program is made with C++, it's usually nice because performance is mostly guaranteed. But if someone told me to write C++ myself, I'd cry. There's too much to memorize, and the standards are too varied. When I go to a project site for maintenance and it's a C++ project, I instantly lose energy — because it's just too difficult. I'd be happy if som…

One of my hobbies is rummaging around thrift stores appreciating tacky things from bygone eras, sifting through ill-conceived modern junk, and delighting in simple, solid tools where I can find them.

That's what it's like to be a C++ programmer.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#175

Post by tralarpa »

maccard wrote: post #38
jdw64 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are so many standards and idioms that it gets confusing. There are still legacy codebases out there — some codebase still use C++98 as their standard, others use C++11... And with Unreal Engine, the modern C++ standard is C++14, right? There are things like smart pointers, but some places don't even use them. I feel like there are just too many features. When I saw template metaprogramming — that new feature —…

This is true of any language. Python with flask vs django, with/without type hints. JavaScript with anhular and vue. The varying standards are no different to major python versions or go versions - arguably there’s even less between most versions than there is in your average go release. The differences in apps and frameworks don’t matter for day to day - std::string, Unreal’s FString and QT’s QString all are similar…

> This is true of any language

Is it? Java has changed a lot, but in such a way that it's still easy to mentally map new features to the old ones, provided you have understood the core language. IDEs can even convert your code from old to new and back.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#176

Post by SJC_Hacker »

bernds74 wrote: post #115
tialaramex wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, a few things (aside from the whole nomenclature argument already in another reply) 1. Stepanov's generic programming is a good idea. Every language you've seen with "generics" that's his idea, to the extent "The STL" is generic programming, everybody agreed it's a good idea. 2. But the STL is very old now, so while the idea is good, this is one of the oldest (Stepanov had tried this in other languages before C++)…

I would argue that even the basic concept behind STL is misguided. The rationale I often see is "you only need N algorithms for M container type, instead of N*M". This ignores the fact that algorithms and data structures are not independent of each other, and also that most of the time these days you're operating on vectors, so M ~= 1. Case in point: list::sort. You don't want to try running quicksort on a linked lis…

List::sort is present exactly for this reason

STD::sort only works on a random access iterator, it won’t even compile if you try it on a list

Re: C++: The Documentary

#177

Post by melenaboija »

I obviously don’t know them personally, but what I get from this old school generation that have been a pillar of computer science and, why not, modern human history, is just a tiny little bit more humbleness than “influential” people nowadays.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#178

Post by pjmlp »

mirmor23 wrote: post #144

Ken Thompson's criticism of C++ as incoherent, complex and garbage heap of ideas still resonates with me; C++98 was the last version I used for work although I've dabbled in 11/17/20 out of curiosity. IMO, if c++/cfront didn't ride on the tails of c, I'm skeptical it would've seen widespread use, but then, that's its main identity which limited it in ways that C++ was not willing to change; It is highly irritating to…

UNIX founders never liked C++ that much, note how Plan 9 and Inferno only have C as the systems language, with the Alef experiment, and later Limbo.

Followed a couple of years later contribution to Go's design, exactly to avoid C++ at Google.

Re: C++: The Documentary

#179

Post by randusername »

raincole wrote: post #26
claiir wrote: post #5

> currently (as of Q3 2025) the fastest-growing of the top four languages in the world… +90% users in the past 3.5 years. Because of AI, right?

If this is a rhetorical question I genuinely don't know what's the implied answer. Why would AI specifically make C++ grow?

Ideas:

- more accessible now that AI handles the high tooling activation energy

- more history and pre-AI internet content

- pybind11 is pretty popular to pair Python logic with C++ performance

- cpp committe is pretty bullish on new contracts and reflection features making C++ a glue language that AI can write well

Re: C++: The Documentary

#180

Post by pjmlp »

tenderfault wrote: post #60

So happy to see Andrei Alexandrescu was included in this documentary. His book on modern C++ design was a mind opener at the time I read it. Maybe still is today. Anybody else read it?

Of course, all his books are a must read.
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