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Ableton Extensions SDK

ableton.com

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Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#41

Post by tomduncalf »

abstractbill wrote: post #9

A couple of times I've tried somewhat seriously to build "google docs for ableton" (meaning two people editing the same project on different computers, seeing each other's edits in realtime). Frustratingly I decided it was impossible to do a really good job of it back then. This sounds like it might finally make it doable!

Ha yeah I have considered the same. There’s not enough info exposed via the Python or Max APIs (or indeed this one) to sync all the state you’d care about so I think the only option would be syncing the actual als files (which are zipped XML) which means you’d only be able to sync at save points

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#42

Post by tomduncalf »

honkycat wrote: post #37

I hate max so much. I wish this could extend to the push 3, I've been working on an orchid clone. It would be TRIVIAL in any other language, but noooo, I have to write a fucking max patch and deal with their trash visual syntax and runtime.

FWIW you can bypass quite a lot of the Max visual stuff by using the JS support, which now finally supports modern JS (the v8 object). A lot of the LOM (Live API) is exposed there though you will no doubt need to use Max objects for some stuff. They also have web UI support with jweb.

I get the frustration coming to Max as a regular developer, but actually when I bothered to learn it was one of the most rewarding uses of time and I find it really quite fun to work in (and frustrating sometimes of course! But the JS support helps). You just need to forget everything you know about programming lol

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#43

Post by peteforde »

Slow_Hand wrote: post #36
peteforde wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I answered this in a different branch of the thread, but you're kind of missing my point. I don't own Max for Live, so the large ecosystem of useful tools that I'd enjoy trying out is unavailable to me. It's not about special powers, just being forced to pay the gatekeeper to the otherwise free/OSS ecosystem.

Max/MSP has always been a paid tool. There was never a situation when you were going to be able to participate without paying. This sounds a little like you're complaining that you cannot watch all of the free Youtube content because you don't want to pay for the device that will display it.

That is... not a good analogy at all.

What it is, though, is a misguided attempt to move the goal posts on what I actually said, which is that a huge amount of the value of Ableton is gatekept behind paid addons.

If a DAW was structured like Blender or KiCAD and designed from the ground up to be extensible (or minimal!) then you wouldn't have any impetus to try to shame people who haven't paid a gate toll to execute software people have contributed to the public domain.

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#44

Post by peteforde »

honkycat wrote: post #38
peteforde wrote: post #11

I've often felt as though the way to make a DAW that competes with Ableton today would be to build the entire UI around composable scripted modules. Far too much of Ableton's secret sauce is hidden away behind Max for Live and top-tier pricing only features. This is a great step in the right direction.

You're describing reaper. Super great for scripting

Cool! I'll check it out.

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#46

Post by ddosmax556 »

abstractbill wrote: post #9

A couple of times I've tried somewhat seriously to build "google docs for ableton" (meaning two people editing the same project on different computers, seeing each other's edits in realtime). Frustratingly I decided it was impossible to do a really good job of it back then. This sounds like it might finally make it doable!

check audiotool

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#47

Post by embedding-shape »

jrickert wrote: post #35

I spent my day hacking on this to see what it’s capable of (built a simple little tool that displays MIDI clips as sheet music: https://github.com/madisonrickert/ableton-sheet-music-extens... ) My initial take on its strengths/weaknesses: - Strong: Using the TS/JS ecosystem to render UI and tools - Medium: Creating custom application windows in a web view. Window management features are pretty limited currently (can’…

Thanks a bunch for the summary! Overall seems like a great start, very similar to how Figma got started, really aggressive sandboxing, then slowly they'll open it up as they explore the exact API surfaces.

Gotta say, slightly sad about the global time signature not being available to get/set, when I read about the new SDK yesterday my mind immediately jumped to bunch of use cases which all use the global time signature :P Oh well, I'm sure it'll be available in the future.

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#48

Post by embedding-shape »

arikrahman wrote: post #45

Wish we could get some native compatiblity with Linux. The closest I've gotten on NixOS was with Bitwig, with a simple compatability script I wrote: https://github.com/ArikRahman/Nixwig

Bitwig has native Linux builds though? Should be very easy, last time I tried it, it was literally click-and-play basically.

Ableton is another beast altogether, and I've also been trying to get it running for years at this point, no end in sight. Last time I tried, after being recommended https://github.com/BEEFY-JOE/AbletonLiveOnLinux (now sadly archived), I managed to get the actual UI to render and be interactive, but still couldn't get proper audio to work with my interface, only software rendered audio, so the quest continues...

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#49

Post by embedding-shape »

abstractbill wrote: post #9

A couple of times I've tried somewhat seriously to build "google docs for ableton" (meaning two people editing the same project on different computers, seeing each other's edits in realtime). Frustratingly I decided it was impossible to do a really good job of it back then. This sounds like it might finally make it doable!

In the past, I've literally done screen-sharing for this, one "instructor" and one "pilot", basically like how you do remote pair programming typically, but with Ableton instead.

Besides that, Ableton themselves list a bunch of tools I assume works on some level, as they're listed in the help pages of Ableton: https://help.ableton.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012680119-Best...

Re: Ableton Extensions SDK

#50

Post by tnolet »

bbgm wrote: post #20

Somewhat unrelated, but the number of times I have invoked Ableton as a metaphor of challenging the status quo is quite high. I was a Cubase user before Ableton showed up and completely upended the DAW world. And they've kept going. This is just what I've been looking for. I never warmed to Max for Live for mods. But the extensions SDK I can get behind.

Totally unrelated, but it's still interesting that a lot of the key music software was / is created in either Berlin (Ableton, Native Instruments) or in / near Hamburg (Steinberg of Cubase — now owned by Yamaha — and Emagic of Logic — now owned by Apple). There must have been something in the air.
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