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Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

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Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#241

Post by pacifika »

bakugo wrote: post #170
antirez wrote: post #120

A few years ago, the probability of such shit reaching the Hacker News home page was near zero, because regardless of the merits, here was not full of normies that could not understand when a behavior is unacceptable (I'm referring to the violence of the language of the issue). And now, here we are, surrounded by people that can't tell the most obvious things.

Similarly, a few years ago, I would've never expected "my magic code generation machine is doing all my work for me now, I don't even bother looking at what it does anymore!" to reach the Hacker News home page on a regular basis, either, yet here we are. Irrational actions lead to irrational reactions.

That’s not how LLMs are used by experienced engineers.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#242

Post by krcz »

nottorp wrote: post #42
roenxi wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you basing this opinion on the issue or actual evidence? Because this github link, although interesting, is almost completely context free on what the drama is beyond "Claude". The rsync maintainers could be anywhere on the spectrum from the perfect and responsible maintainer to incompetent children and we couldn't really tell.

> is almost completely context free on what the drama is beyond "Claude" As soon as it happened their rsync based backup system that was working before started to fail. It says right there.

I believe your point is not that it has never failed for anyone in the last few years after upgrade? Then, if the claim is that breakage is considerably worse than it used to be before using coding agents: it is possible, but I think it requires more evidence than a few anecdotes.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#243

Post by [deleted] »

consp wrote: post #125
thevinter wrote: post #116

This whole brigading is bizzarre and some people are behaving like irrational animals. I potentially understand the motivations that might bring one to want to "win" this battle but this really isn't it - it just makes you sound like a fanatic. It takes 5 minutes to search for "regression" on the issue page and go through the 17 results. There are potentially even more on the tracker used prior to github. I think thi…

> I think this behavior is very silly and people are just trying to justify their hate to AI by latching onto every possible thing It's not silly to have issues with something. People act on their issues. Possibly not the issue underlying the commit at hand here but something else, and act on it which makes it something to consider. My guess is people are tired of the "AI is the greatest thing since [cultural referen…

[deleted]

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#244

Post by dragontamer »

akerl_ wrote: post #231
otabdeveloper4 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. There is no "anti-AI derangement", the reaction to slop is normal.

Spamming an open source developer with angry comments because they decided to use a new tool for the code they write and publish freely is not normal.

This is rsync we are talking about. A bug in rsync basically means lost data and/or unreliable backups.

I think it's normal to be pissed at lost data. Maybe it's not socially acceptable to spit in the face of a volunteer but it's 100% human to feel annoyed by an obvious drop in code quality.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#245

Post by mort96 »

mort96 wrote: post #167
KolmogorovComp wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost all the commits are regarding the testsuite or CI, both of which are IMO great use of AI.

I think that’s misleading. Yes, almost all commits co-authored by Claude lately are about test suite and CI, but that’s just because almost all commits lately are about test suite and CI. The commits which aren’t test suite and CI are also co-authored by Claude. Go a bit further back in the commit history (April 29 onwards) you still see a sea of non-CI/testsuite Claude commits.

Oh and another thing I just learned: it seems like the reason there are so many test suite commits recently is ... Tridge got Claude to rewrite all the tests in Python and delete the old shell test suite: https://github.com/RsyncProject/rsync/pull/903/

That's ballsy. I feel like if I used Claude heavily for a piece of code, an existing test suite would be something I would want to rely on to catch mistakes.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#246

Post by pacifika »

comrade1234 wrote: post #193

I'm pretty dependent on rsync across all of my ubuntu servers. I just checked and most of my servers are on openrsync but one, built most recently, is on classic rsync. Not sure why the old servers are openrsync and the new one on classic rsync - I would expect the opposite. Anyway, on that one server: sudo apt-mark hold rsync

You rather open the server up to security issues than have software where the developer has been assisted by ai which you feel decreases the quality of the code or is it for moral reasons?

Rsync is not being vibe coded, and it’s not become slop so would love to understand the position.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#247

Post by vasac »

mschuster91 wrote: post #233
miroljub wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. When someone does that, he gets rightfully called out. On the other side, accusations of being Russian trol are pretty common, even here on HN. Why are people more sensitive to antisemitism than to antislavism? Double standards, or just a hate induced by decades / centuries of indoctrination?

> Why are people more sensitive to antisemitism than to antislavism? Calling someone a vatnik or Russian troll is mostly because the statement that provokes such a callout reproduces Russian propaganda talking points, and Russia has been running propaganda campaigns for well over a decade now. Similarly, ordinary Russians aren't called orcs, but Russian soldiers are called that because of their despicable behavior in…

[dead]

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#248

Post by ruszki »

ddosmax556 wrote: post #186
helsinkiandrew wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do we need AI here? As several comments in the issue mention, it's up to the developers that contribute to an open source package to decide how they do it. Complaining on an issue tracker (apparently without proof) about AI ruining a piece of software is a form of "Open Source contributor abuse" discussed frequently on Hacker News [1] https://github.com/RsyncProject/rsync/issues/929#issuecommen... > The issue t…

I agree, if I was the maintainer this would be an extremely tiring community feedback. People coming in "I encountered a bug, I don't know what the bug is but I thought about it for a second and it's obviously your descision to do xyz". As a maintainer, what are you supposed to do? It's not more useful than a ticket "somethings wrong idk what" which is useless enough to close without further action. But it puts the b…

I don’t know the details of this exact instance, but saying that there are reliability issues is a valid feedback if reliability plummets.

As far as I know, nobody with data claims that vibe coding doesn’t affect reliability negatively.

People will connect these two things.

Many times, when reliability doesn’t plummet really. For example, there were huge negative news about a Samsung phone a few years back, that it easily causes fires. Sales were affected by this. Interestingly, next year, they released basically the same thing under different name, and complains were never that loud again. And as far as I know, when they were loud, there was nothing special about that particular model regarding this. So it’s possible that outrage is not validated at all.

They will also connect these, when reliability plummets, but it’s not because of vibe coding.

And they will connect, when it is the real culprit in general, but their problems are not affected by vibe coding.

And of course also when vibe coding really causes their problems.

In any case, the original statements will be true. Do we really want to make a product less reliable to implement features and bugs which we deemed not that important before? Especially with a stable product?

Of course, these on the maintainers, but it’s interesting that forcing AI and their consequences on us - like how Microsoft, Google, etc do - is the default, and not the other way around according to many in this thread and others.

Re: Please Do Not Vibe Fuck Up This Software

#249

Post by ls612 »

thevinter wrote: post #116

This whole brigading is bizzarre and some people are behaving like irrational animals. I potentially understand the motivations that might bring one to want to "win" this battle but this really isn't it - it just makes you sound like a fanatic. It takes 5 minutes to search for "regression" on the issue page and go through the 17 results. There are potentially even more on the tracker used prior to github. I think thi…

AI has become a partisan political issue with all of the attendant consequences. At this point you may as well complain about the sun rising in the east :(
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