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The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

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Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#51

Post by miohtama »

jjcm wrote: post #2

A few things - this is one step in a long, LONG path. AV2 is currently unusable in its current state (the encoder typically runs at around 1fps on good hardware), and likely will remain so til ~2028 when the first av2 hardware accelerated chips start dropping. Even then, I wouldn't expect AV2 streams to be common til 2030. IMO, if it were just the efficiency gains on the table (which are substantial - ~20-30% over AV…

In HW accelerated chips, what part of the calculations they usually accelerate? Could it be possible to repurpose old HW?

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#52

Post by ZeroGravitas »

lofaszvanitt wrote: post #40
ethin wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may always happen but it would happen less if we updated patent laws to fine people who filed invalid patents or enforced some kind of similar punishment. If you file a patent, it's up to you to verify that your patent is actually valid, and the courts shouldn't have to do that legwork for you. It also doesn't help that the patent office/components of governments don't review patents as thoroughly as they used to.…

Why patents is a problem, please explain. If you build something that has been patented, then, well, you pay the per piece fee on it.

> In the 1980s, when IBM accused Sun of violating seven patents, Sun examined the patents and argued that IBM didn't have a case. The reply of IBM's lawyers was "maybe you don't infringe these seven patents. But we have 10,000 U.S. patents. Do you really want us to go back to Armonk [IBM headquarters in New York] and find seven patents you do infringe? Or do you want to make this easy and just pay us $20 million?" And Sun paid out.[4]

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#53

Post by ChadNauseam »

Dwedit wrote: post #13

What I'm interested in is seeing how this will improve the AVIF image format. AVIF stomps the competition for low-bitrate still images (where chroma subsampling is used). For lossless images, not so much. Lossless JPEG XL and lossless WEBP make lossless AVIF look like a joke.

AVIF is for sure my favorite image format right now. No other format has the quadfecta of lossless, HDR, transparency, browser support. Plus as you said, for very compressed images it looks amazing. It blows my mind how small AVIF files can be. Also, unlike HEIC and Ultra HDR JPEG, it actually supports HDR natively as part of the file format rather than doing the hacky sidecar gain map trick. I know it doesn't matter to everyone, but I just love HDR and AVIF is the only format that I feel like really takes it seriously.

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#55

Post by boriskourt »

miohtama wrote: post #51
jjcm wrote: post #2

A few things - this is one step in a long, LONG path. AV2 is currently unusable in its current state (the encoder typically runs at around 1fps on good hardware), and likely will remain so til ~2028 when the first av2 hardware accelerated chips start dropping. Even then, I wouldn't expect AV2 streams to be common til 2030. IMO, if it were just the efficiency gains on the table (which are substantial - ~20-30% over AV…

In HW accelerated chips, what part of the calculations they usually accelerate? Could it be possible to repurpose old HW?

One of the biggest gains of having dedicated hardware is that the computation doesn’t happen on the general hardware.

This is what makes it viable on mobile devices where system responsiveness and power efficiency are high priority.

Generally these hardware decoders haven’t been retoolalble.

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#56

Post by Bombthecat »

jjcm wrote: post #2

A few things - this is one step in a long, LONG path. AV2 is currently unusable in its current state (the encoder typically runs at around 1fps on good hardware), and likely will remain so til ~2028 when the first av2 hardware accelerated chips start dropping. Even then, I wouldn't expect AV2 streams to be common til 2030. IMO, if it were just the efficiency gains on the table (which are substantial - ~20-30% over AV…

I feel like in 2030 it's more likely that we send 480p and just upscale with ai on the other end

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#57

Post by Gigachad »

wmf wrote: post #25
Dwedit wrote: post #13

What I'm interested in is seeing how this will improve the AVIF image format. AVIF stomps the competition for low-bitrate still images (where chroma subsampling is used). For lossless images, not so much. Lossless JPEG XL and lossless WEBP make lossless AVIF look like a joke.

Honestly AVIF2 is the last thing we need now. There are way too many minority image formats already.

There aren’t _that_ many. HEIF has been an unusually large pain in the ass just because it’s both patent encumbered and incredibly popular since the iPhone and many cameras use it.

JPEG is woefully outdated with the lack of HDR and modern compression, HEIF can’t be used without paying a license, webp was designed just for extremely efficient small images rather than local storage, avif I’ve never seen used ever, and JPEG XL is on track to be the next major format.

I agree we don’t need an avif2, but until jpeg xl there really weren’t any decent alternatives for jpeg.

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#58

Post by hulitu »

Bombthecat wrote: post #56
jjcm wrote: post #2

A few things - this is one step in a long, LONG path. AV2 is currently unusable in its current state (the encoder typically runs at around 1fps on good hardware), and likely will remain so til ~2028 when the first av2 hardware accelerated chips start dropping. Even then, I wouldn't expect AV2 streams to be common til 2030. IMO, if it were just the efficiency gains on the table (which are substantial - ~20-30% over AV…

I feel like in 2030 it's more likely that we send 480p and just upscale with ai on the other end

480p ? More like 200i. There's a race to the bottom driven by those "up to" codecs.

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#59

Post by hulitu »

Gigachad wrote: post #57
wmf wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly AVIF2 is the last thing we need now. There are way too many minority image formats already.

There aren’t _that_ many. HEIF has been an unusually large pain in the ass just because it’s both patent encumbered and incredibly popular since the iPhone and many cameras use it. JPEG is woefully outdated with the lack of HDR and modern compression, HEIF can’t be used without paying a license, webp was designed just for extremely efficient small images rather than local storage, avif I’ve never seen used ever, and…

> There aren’t _that_ many.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_graphics_file_fo...

Re: The AV2 Video Standard Has Released (Final v1.0 Specification)

#60

Post by dataflow »

zamadatix wrote: post #23
ethin wrote: post #19

And how long will it take before someone implements this standard and gets sued because Adobe or Dolby or whoever wanted to get slapped down? My knowledge may be out of date but if this is as "open" as AV1, I'm very skeptical that the individual companies will actually allow that. Greed and all that.

It took 7 years for the first patent assertion claim against AV1 to go to the courts and it will probably take a while for that case to resolve. Funnily enough, it wasn't from the pool constantly putting itself in the news about it over the years. I.e. it can take quite a while before attempts are made.

On that topic: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2026/03/av1s-open-royalty-fr...
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