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SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

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101–110 of 169 posts

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#101
post #13

> Founded by alums of Tesla and the autonomous vehicle company Cruise, the San Francisco startup has received hundreds of millions in venture capital funding and is valued at $2 billion Stop outsourcing the cost of your vision to the rest of society. Especially when it’s peanuts to you and meaningful to, in this case, the host of what they call an apartment and you seem to think is a test course.

> Founded by alums of Tesla

Learned from the best of them, I see.

Modern tech culture is a blight on society.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#102
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think GP disagrees with you. They said it wouldn't be a good idea if they had been honest. Elsewhere they call for the employees to face charges.

Ah, I see. Pardon me making him a scapegoat. My rant in between bouts of wrestling with mobile sandbox subscription testing weirdness should have been directed at a vague cohort of less considerate SV folks, so instead I wish to thank him for trying to make the world a better place, and I wouldn't mind if he invited me skiing or flying sometime so we can discuss how I can help him make the world a better place. :)

I find your ideas to be intriguing, and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#103
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fine to make mistakes, that's how you learn. The problem here was that they didn't announce to the host that they are doing a test of their in-development equipment. So the host wasn't able to add the additional risk and hassle to the price, which in this instance would have been a quite legitimate ask as the robot damaged their revenue generating property. It's very ironic that Airbnb itself has done similar pr…

> The problem here was that they didn't announce to the host that they are doing a test of their in-development equipment. I might be okay forgiving skirting the disclosure rules BUT only if they tried to be model tenants and, if there was any damage, took steps to proactively make things right. If you're breaking the rules, even if there was no damage, you should definitely be cleaning up and putting things back in…

This was my thought. I can understand not wanting to go to the hassle of trying to explain that you're testing an experimental prototype robot to a confused Airbnb owner.

What I find inexcusable is not owning up to the damage and paying to fix it when your prototype goes on a rampage of destruction.

Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break...

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#104
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's exactly this ethos, the "move fast and break things", and oh, we don't give a fuck about who/what we damage in the process - careless people indeed. I am someone who came of age during an incredibly hopeful time about how technology could be a force for good. The silicon valley ethos at present is totally morally bankrupt and rotten to the core.

It sounds like they cost a couple hundred dollars in damages I’m not sure it damns a whole generation

Where was "a generation" mentioned? The "silicon valley ethos" is not a generational thing.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#105
post #4

>Donovan alleges that employees of the Bot Company(opens in new tab) rented his home “under false pretenses” to conduct prototype testing on robots they’re training to do household chores. >A refrigerator shelf was cracked, and a broken glass or dish had been left in the garbage disposal. A wooden nightstand drawer was chipped. Cups and plates were in the wrong places. It looked like the furniture had been moved arou…

It's exactly this ethos, the "move fast and break things", and oh, we don't give a fuck about who/what we damage in the process - careless people indeed. I am someone who came of age during an incredibly hopeful time about how technology could be a force for good. The silicon valley ethos at present is totally morally bankrupt and rotten to the core.

Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix them and make things right.

If you break a production server you don't just leave it broken...

I'm assuming these companies have VC cash, so not just paying for repairs and risking negative publicity seems extremely foolish.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's exactly this ethos, the "move fast and break things", and oh, we don't give a fuck about who/what we damage in the process - careless people indeed. I am someone who came of age during an incredibly hopeful time about how technology could be a force for good. The silicon valley ethos at present is totally morally bankrupt and rotten to the core.

Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix them and make things right. If you break a production server you don't just leave it broken... I'm assuming these companies have VC cash, so not just paying for repairs and risking negative publicity seems extremely foolish.

No it's not. I hate normalising that approach.

Do things right is where we should be heading.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#108
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “Sorry :( Did my best!” said a pithy message the group left on a whiteboard on his scuffed-up dining table. Well, no wonder people don't have faith in the people selling AI.

Love that part. It really illustrates how incompetent these people are. That’s why the need for robots, they are projecting their incompetence on other people! Also, if this is the best they can do and left such a mess, don’t let them operate robots or any machines! Teach them to use a mop and then maybe upgrade them to a vacuum, and if they pass, let them use a sink garbage disposal under adult supervision.

The were incompetent enough to go to real world testing when these issues would have been obvious from a basic model kitchen test. Obviously their bot is in the very early development stages where it can't do any of the basic things right, they're nowhere near the phase where they needed real world testing. You don't need a real house to tell that your bot keeps damaging furniture, floors, and other items. You iron that out in the lab, then go in a real setup.

And yet they weren't able to build a model house or even just some model rooms for a controlled environment and practice there full time first. They could have done round the clock testing, with full flexibility of the arrangement, no need to waste time moving hardware around and risk damage, no liability, and more. A fake house costs next to nothing. A (fake) model kitchen is cheaper than an Airbnb stay.

Have you seen how many public demos from manufacturers of advanced robots like Boston Dynamics are using "artificial" obstacles and layouts? It's obvious they did a lot of development in those conditions. You don't need someone's home to find out if your robot can grab a plate without destroying it, or climb a flight of stairs.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#109
post #4

>Donovan alleges that employees of the Bot Company(opens in new tab) rented his home “under false pretenses” to conduct prototype testing on robots they’re training to do household chores. >A refrigerator shelf was cracked, and a broken glass or dish had been left in the garbage disposal. A wooden nightstand drawer was chipped. Cups and plates were in the wrong places. It looked like the furniture had been moved arou…

It's exactly this ethos, the "move fast and break things", and oh, we don't give a fuck about who/what we damage in the process - careless people indeed. I am someone who came of age during an incredibly hopeful time about how technology could be a force for good. The silicon valley ethos at present is totally morally bankrupt and rotten to the core.

A good doc on this subject: https://machines.cargo.site/

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#110
post #95

This is not Donovan's "home", as the article states. It's his house and rental business. And he was snooping on his guests when he was taking the rubbish bins out and happened to notice cables and people typing on laptops inside the house - which I'm sure is an explicit violation of Airbnb policies.

How could seeing people in a house from a public area possibly be an explicit violation of policies?
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