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What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

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Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#21

Post by davemc500hats »

unimpressive wrote: post #9
braco_alva wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I know that 9gag is not the most serious business out there, but don't you think it could be a viable and sustainable business?

I think it's because 9gag is the site that redditors like to mock. I'm not sure I blame them. https://9gag.com/gag/5553078 https://9gag.com/gag/5920690

you guys feel free to mock 9GAG, 500, & YC.

9GAG has grown to tens of millions of users and billions of page views per month in less than 2 years. the company was generating single-digit millions with a team of less than 10 people.

in short, it's a great business that has tremendous scale, and you haters can all go put a sock in it.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#22

Post by davemc500hats »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #16

Perhaps I am mistaken however no one is calling anything dead, they are simply switching strategies. In my opinion B2B wins hands down when the product could be used equally by businesses and consumers at a minimum. When I started VisiDraft a year and a half ago, my strategy was B2B because my clientele would be using the product for work. I could as easily have structured my plan to have a consumer facing applicatio…

both areas have tons of opportunity.

however, there is plenty of growth in consumer spending and particularly in online ecommerce all over the world. while I won't disagree corporations are also sitting on lots of cash, it's certainly not the case that consumer online spending is flat, even in the US (& absolutely not around the world).

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#23

Post by davemc500hats »

dave1619 wrote: post #10

Fred Wilson's specialty is with larger consumer/enterprise investments ( http://www.usv.com/investments/ ) vs Dave McClure's speciality is in smaller investments and also international. According to Dave, it seems like there's so slowing of momentum for growth with the smaller (base hits) he sees both domestically and internationally. And I appreciate his blog post that champions the consumer web. But I wonder with F…

I think the lesson is to focus on consumer & small biz opportunities with clear path to revenue.

if you don't have clear path to revenue, then you better have tremendous traction.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#24

Post by davemc500hats »

tomasien wrote: post #11

For background: Dave believes in companies with straightforward revenue strategies with measurable traction that could hockey-stick but haven't yet. He believes in a lage and talented mentor pool to find the design, data, and/or distribution problems standing in the way of accelerated customer/user growth to add the value needed to get to the next level. He looks for companies that could exit 20mm-500mm but wants MOR…

thanks, that's a good summary of our approach.

however, we will also invest in a few stories without clear path to revenue if growth is strong. but admittedly this isn't our favorite strategy. we certainly prefer strong business model over none, even with a small base of customers.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#25

Post by sbierwagen »

kapilkale wrote: post #13
sbierwagen wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't know that. This significantly alters my opinion of YC.

Why does it alter your opinion of YC?

I hang out with artists a lot, and they hate 9gag, mostly because it is a business based on wholescale theft of intellectual property.

Just like Youtube, of course, but Youtube actually shares ad revenue with creators, while "publishing" your work on 9gag is manifestly insane.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#26

Post by tomasien »

davemc500hats wrote: post #24
tomasien wrote: post #11

For background: Dave believes in companies with straightforward revenue strategies with measurable traction that could hockey-stick but haven't yet. He believes in a lage and talented mentor pool to find the design, data, and/or distribution problems standing in the way of accelerated customer/user growth to add the value needed to get to the next level. He looks for companies that could exit 20mm-500mm but wants MOR…

thanks, that's a good summary of our approach. however, we will also invest in a few stories without clear path to revenue if growth is strong. but admittedly this isn't our favorite strategy. we certainly prefer strong business model over none, even with a small base of customers.

Thanks for the addendum! I'm aware of that corollary but it's harder to explain as a coherent thesis. Paul always made it very clear to me that "there are starving startups in India than more traction than you" and "10mm users is the new 1mm users" so I've never been clear where that line was for you guys. As such, I usually leave it out of my explanations of my understanding of the 500 thesis.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#27

Post by braco_alva »

davemc500hats wrote: post #21
unimpressive wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's because 9gag is the site that redditors like to mock. I'm not sure I blame them. https://9gag.com/gag/5553078 https://9gag.com/gag/5920690

you guys feel free to mock 9GAG, 500, & YC. 9GAG has grown to tens of millions of users and billions of page views per month in less than 2 years. the company was generating single-digit millions with a team of less than 10 people. in short, it's a great business that has tremendous scale, and you haters can all go put a sock in it.

That was my point, it might not have the best content on the internet,but it clearly has a huge user base, and a very active one. I don't get why it wouldn't be a good investment decision.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#28

Post by unimpressive »

davemc500hats wrote: post #21
unimpressive wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's because 9gag is the site that redditors like to mock. I'm not sure I blame them. https://9gag.com/gag/5553078 https://9gag.com/gag/5920690

you guys feel free to mock 9GAG, 500, & YC. 9GAG has grown to tens of millions of users and billions of page views per month in less than 2 years. the company was generating single-digit millions with a team of less than 10 people. in short, it's a great business that has tremendous scale, and you haters can all go put a sock in it.

Actually, I don't doubt that you have good reasons for investing in 9gag. I'm just not the target audience for the content. (And consequently think it's a bit crude.)

I'd originally posted (in response to sbierwagen) that 9gag receiving investments 'significantly altered my opinion of 9gag'. But then deleted it because the obvious interpretation wasn't my intended one. I figured the monetization scenario for 9gag might look good if PG +others are investing.

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#29

Post by selamattidur »

davemc500hats wrote: post #21
unimpressive wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's because 9gag is the site that redditors like to mock. I'm not sure I blame them. https://9gag.com/gag/5553078 https://9gag.com/gag/5920690

you guys feel free to mock 9GAG, 500, & YC. 9GAG has grown to tens of millions of users and billions of page views per month in less than 2 years. the company was generating single-digit millions with a team of less than 10 people. in short, it's a great business that has tremendous scale, and you haters can all go put a sock in it.

Why is it a great business? Because it has users and almost no barrier to entry? How sustainable is that?

Re: What Hasn’t Changed: The Internet Keeps Getting Bigger

#30

Post by rohamg »

rohamg wrote: post #20

Framed through Naval's vision of individuals as micro-enterprises, Dave and Fred's perspectives line up pretty nicely together. The line between consumer and enterprise is blurring in more ways than one.

for the record i think Dave is absolutely right it's easier than ever to build a consumer audience (albeit at times a niche one = time to pivot). at the same time, i think Fred's point is focused on the fundraising prospects for each type of business, and in this i think he's right: the "powers that be" (aka the later stage investors who, as Dave rightly points out, sometimes don't know whose tail they're chasing) are demanding enterprise deals right now. in response to Dave's point on the difficulty of scaling sales in enterprise, two trends are making that easier: a) BigCo interest in startups from every angle is very high and b) individual interest by traditional "enterprise types" (mba's, executives, etc) to get in on the startup pie is increasing as well. not necessarily a good thing on the macro level, but paired with a killer product it can make scaling more straightforward.
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