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Using AI to write better code more slowly

nolanlawson.com

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Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#71

Post by raven12345 »

rootnod3 wrote: post #12
bottlepalm wrote: post #4

I've hit this point with AI where it's not a simple process, but a long drawn out back and forth. I'll use AI to design the implementation of a medium sized, cross cutting feature. Review all the details, maybe iterate on just that. Then implement with Claude 4.7 Max - which runs slower, but does a better job. Then review the implementation, then have Codex GPT 5.5 xhigh fast review it - which almost always finds cor…

And then Anthropic has an outage and you what...have a coffee break until then? All that time babysitting the AIs just to be a little faster but probably with less knowledge/control over what they did?

You can have multiple tasks running

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#72

Post by DonHopkins »

well_ackshually wrote: post #46
efitz wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you only have one AI window open, you’re doing it wrong. You task swap to another window/agent, get it working on something, rinse and repeat. I can keep 4 busy most of the time. When I task swap I also check in on what the other agents are doing to make sure they’re on track, not blocked and not struggling.

congratulations on your soon to be coming burnout. Keeping that many tasks in parallel, running all the time will kill you.

It's great to work from home so you can take nice little micro naps while code's generating, reviewing, building, and deploying.

A calm attentive alternative of vibe coding: restful coding.

It's much easier to read and review code after a refreshing cat nap, especially with a real cat.

Too bad that's not usually acceptable to do that in the office. It should be! Slacking off by sword fighting all day is too exhausting.

https://xkcd.com/303/

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#73

Post by Waterluvian »

I think my current conclusion is that AI makes more important than ever.

I’m not exactly sure what is but I feel it. I think it’s quality and authenticity and craftsmanship. That difference between an expensive tool and a cheap one that you can’t easily describe but you just know it.

Is there a word for this? I bet the Japanese or Germans have a word for this.

I use AI a lot now. But I also do it in small steps. It isn’t a craftsman, but it can help me be one.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#74

Post by samrus »

Waterluvian wrote: post #73

I think my current conclusion is that AI makes more important than ever. I’m not exactly sure what is but I feel it. I think it’s quality and authenticity and craftsmanship. That difference between an expensive tool and a cheap one that you can’t easily describe but you just know it. Is there a word for this? I bet the Japanese or Germans have a word for this. I use AI a lot now. But I also do it in small steps. It i…

People use the word "taste" to describe that

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#75

Post by Waterluvian »

samrus wrote: post #74
Waterluvian wrote: post #73

I think my current conclusion is that AI makes more important than ever. I’m not exactly sure what is but I feel it. I think it’s quality and authenticity and craftsmanship. That difference between an expensive tool and a cheap one that you can’t easily describe but you just know it. Is there a word for this? I bet the Japanese or Germans have a word for this. I use AI a lot now. But I also do it in small steps. It i…

People use the word "taste" to describe that

Yeah, maybe that.

I feel like AI promises a factory that can make Walmart quality tools. Which I think will make the well-crafted tools more important than ever.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#76

Post by dawnerd »

bottlepalm wrote: post #4

I've hit this point with AI where it's not a simple process, but a long drawn out back and forth. I'll use AI to design the implementation of a medium sized, cross cutting feature. Review all the details, maybe iterate on just that. Then implement with Claude 4.7 Max - which runs slower, but does a better job. Then review the implementation, then have Codex GPT 5.5 xhigh fast review it - which almost always finds cor…

When I use ai to code this is pretty close to my workflow too but I find it ends up taking at best just as long as if I were to write the code myself. If m some cases I’ve thrown away what the ai has done and just done it myself. I think that’s just a skill people need to learn - at a certain point you have to cut your losses. I’ve seen some coworkers argue back and forth with an llm trying to get it to do something. Especially true on simpler changes.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#77

Post by nullsanity »

qsera wrote: post #65
aomix wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talking the problem to death with the AI before implementation is a nice zone for me. I feel productive, get good results out of the AI, and still largely understand the code. That’s the part of the AI revolution that I feel has made me a better engineer because I argue about design and architecture all day with a robot.

>I argue about design and architecture all day with a robot. You will outgrow it at some point.

Its like that phase people go through where they argue with morons on reddit, and then one day grow up and realize that most of these people are unemployed/underemployed terminally online nobodies aren't ever going to learn anything, and even if they did it wouldn't impact the world since they were just some below average hobbyist anyway and aren't in charge of anything more important than a box of paperclips.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#78

Post by dawnerd »

scosman wrote: post #19
bottlepalm wrote: post #4

I've hit this point with AI where it's not a simple process, but a long drawn out back and forth. I'll use AI to design the implementation of a medium sized, cross cutting feature. Review all the details, maybe iterate on just that. Then implement with Claude 4.7 Max - which runs slower, but does a better job. Then review the implementation, then have Codex GPT 5.5 xhigh fast review it - which almost always finds cor…

yes exactly. Too many people ask AI to one-shot complex tasks, and wonder it behaves like a junior asked to rush something. I have my own skill: 5 rounds of research/planning/test-planning. Interactive with me in loop for all important decisions. Starts with high level shape, then details. Planning can take 2-3 days of my time, then the implementation agent can take many hours (Opus 4.7). It splits the implementation…

Even fully planned it’s still no better than a junior dev. You’re leaving out how much back and forth you have the ai do on itself, which you’d have on a junior dev too. In the end does it matter if it’s giving you what you want? Guess not really. But let’s not act like it’s crazy good when you’re still doing a lot of rounds of revisions on something an experienced dev would know to do right the first time.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#79

Post by jerezzprime »

rootnod3 wrote: post #12
bottlepalm wrote: post #4

I've hit this point with AI where it's not a simple process, but a long drawn out back and forth. I'll use AI to design the implementation of a medium sized, cross cutting feature. Review all the details, maybe iterate on just that. Then implement with Claude 4.7 Max - which runs slower, but does a better job. Then review the implementation, then have Codex GPT 5.5 xhigh fast review it - which almost always finds cor…

And then Anthropic has an outage and you what...have a coffee break until then? All that time babysitting the AIs just to be a little faster but probably with less knowledge/control over what they did?

Yes get a coffee. Being able to execute 5 things at once is amazing, but it's a recipe for burnout. We have to be more careful and explicit about how we spend our time, and that means more explicit time away. If this thing makes you 10x more effective (I truly believe it can), you can afford to spend 20% less time behind the desk and more time doing whatever it is that actually makes you happy. Hopefully your manager understands that calculus.

Re: Using AI to write better code more slowly

#80

Post by themanmaran »

As I read this, I'm also working through a pretty dense feature that took a fair bit of iteration. The end result is actually significantly less code than it was about halfway through. And I was wondering if the AI actually helped me at all, since surely I could have written the code in the same time it took to iterate

But! Because of AI I was able to rapidly hack out like 4 variants of this feature that I didn't like. And felt comfortable throwing them away just as quick.

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