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Everything Technical in F1

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Re: Everything Technical in F1

#51

Post by adhipg »

tomfakes wrote: post #38
junto wrote: post #25

A friend of mine was a transmission/gearbox designer for F1 cars. It was fascinating to hear about the things going on behind the scenes. Most teams have components built by a handful of specialized external engineering companies. Some things are dealt with internally, but the lower order teams don't have the budgets to deal with much of the technology in-house. Ferrari is the exception and they do almost everything…

I've seen reverse gear used on several cars this year to get a car back on track after going off. I think the FIA must be testing for this operation (otherwise the teams would find some way to work around the regulations)

I think reverse gears have been a part of these cars for at-least as long as I've been watching F1 (last 12 years).

The utility of them however has been restricted to just getting back to the track or in the pit-lane.

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#52

Post by bgarbiak »

chrisboesing wrote: post #15
brunorsini wrote: post #2

I could never get interested in F1 again after Senna's tragic death.

I can totally understand that. What I don't get is why the F1 officials haven't learned more out of that tragic accident. Sure the cars are much safer than they were when Senna died, but why do they have to at more and more races in city centers? Sure, I can understand that they want to keep Monaco for historic reason, but there isn't a good reason to have races in the city centers of Valencia, Singapore, and soon Ne…

Street tracks has to conform to the same strict rules as the regular ones. That's why they usually have much smaller average speeds, so things like huge run-off areas are not needed. Take a look at your video again: only in one place the car reaches 300km/h. Crashes on street tracks happen quite often (less room for errors), yet I can't recall any serious one. Ok, Kubica's shunt in Montreal looked scary - but Circuit Gilles Villeneuve is a semi-street and unusually fast track. The new ones are fine (safety-wise), really. Open cockpits and loose wheels are the big issues for now - both being currently worked on.

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#53

Post by foobarram »

junto wrote: post #25

A friend of mine was a transmission/gearbox designer for F1 cars. It was fascinating to hear about the things going on behind the scenes. Most teams have components built by a handful of specialized external engineering companies. Some things are dealt with internally, but the lower order teams don't have the budgets to deal with much of the technology in-house. Ferrari is the exception and they do almost everything…

>>The lower order teams get called "pit dodgers" (behind their backs). External companies know that statistically these teams don't finish so many races, and the attention to detail in the design and finish for these teams is much less than those premium teams receive. ==

Not true. I have worked for several lower rug F1 teams (purely by chance - I live in Oxfordshire and I am not interested in relocating to Marnello). Suppliers love lower order teams - and its because they punch above their weight. Take for example the Saubers - low budget (~USD80 million?), high skill engineers. Also, suppliers provide standard components - they do not affect the race outcome - they are standardized - take for example CF brakes. An F1 race outcome depends on car balance w.r.t aero maps. Nothing more.

>>It is sadly a vicious circle. Statistically, they will have worse drivers, who are more likely to crash or damage the cars early in the race, so often the cars in the lower order teams don't have the required staying power for the entire race. ==

Not true. Statistically, all the best drivers have come from lower order teams. Hamilton is probably the only exception. Just look at history.

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#54

Post by [deleted] »

junto wrote: post #25

A friend of mine was a transmission/gearbox designer for F1 cars. It was fascinating to hear about the things going on behind the scenes. Most teams have components built by a handful of specialized external engineering companies. Some things are dealt with internally, but the lower order teams don't have the budgets to deal with much of the technology in-house. Ferrari is the exception and they do almost everything…

[deleted]

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#55

Post by nikcub »

scott_karana wrote: post #50

As cool as the technology in F1 is, I wonder what might be created if there weren't such labyrinthine rules imposed on them. I think a league like Can-Am, with only a budget cap, would be fascinating. Would we be seeing three-wheel drive cars? Supercapacitor-driven electrics? Something entirely different? (For those who don't know, many innovations came out of the league [1], especially from the Chapparal constructor…

the developers of Grand Turismo, the video game, asked famed F1 designer Adrian Newey[0] to design the ultimate race car for their game. The question was:

> "If you built the fastest racing car on land, one that throws aside all rules and regulations, what would that car look like, how would it perform, and how would it feel to drive?"

He came up with the Red Bull x2010[1]

[0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Newey

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Bull_X2010

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#56

Post by ivanmaeder »

I don't remember and F1 story getting so popular on HN, the Austin GP has helped :) I think the sport is fascinating because it really is a battle of geek engineers and drivers. The most successful geek around today is this guy:

http://en.espnf1.com/korea/motorsport/image/92108.html

Normally the champagne can get stuck in your eyes.

These guys and the huge teams behind them battle off track with each other and with the regulations, and the strategists and races battle on track. The off track battles make these cars safe in accidents at 300 km/h (186 mph),

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtrzvwayniM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GQ0MBMhDjo

Robert Kubica was unconscious after the crash and he missed a race but Mark Webber hit the barrier at 280 km/h (174 mph) and walked away from it. As some other readers have mentioned, there has not been a driver death in F1 since 1994.

A typical trade off we might think about in software is this:

http://cheezburger.com/6747638272

:)

In F1 the trade offs when writing the regulations are between safety, cost reductions and entertainment.

And yet the two aspects that make the cars go slower (safety and cost reductions) are exploited to the maximum. No matter if wings are taken off the car to reduce downforce, or traction control is banned to reduce speed into and out of corners, or if fans are declared illegal (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-rZKlutlzE), the cars each year go just as fast as the year before.

For example in 2009 this little trick from Brawn GP caught most teams off guard and won them the championship:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5oDu6nSgBg

Interesting story: the development of this car had been carried out by three teams separated from each other so that they each understood and explored the regulations differently.

If you're interested in F1 I recommend Youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZthxDFy_pM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmOixmxpXF4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHjeAS7HQbg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGUZJVY-sHo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-eiKYyVr2A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOhgI1hQA68

The Peter Windsor podcast is good, and Scarbs has been on it a few times:

http://smibs.tv/the-flying-lap

And there are plenty of blogs around. For me the perfect dose of racing is:

http://axisofoversteer.blogspot.com/

The last race of the season is this weekend in Brazil. Qualifying is on Saturday, the race on Sunday. The times are at http://www.formula1.com/

I sound like an F1 spokesperson!

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#58

Post by junto »

foobarram wrote: post #53
junto wrote: post #25

A friend of mine was a transmission/gearbox designer for F1 cars. It was fascinating to hear about the things going on behind the scenes. Most teams have components built by a handful of specialized external engineering companies. Some things are dealt with internally, but the lower order teams don't have the budgets to deal with much of the technology in-house. Ferrari is the exception and they do almost everything…

>>The lower order teams get called "pit dodgers" (behind their backs). External companies know that statistically these teams don't finish so many races, and the attention to detail in the design and finish for these teams is much less than those premium teams receive. == Not true. I have worked for several lower rug F1 teams (purely by chance - I live in Oxfordshire and I am not interested in relocating to Marnello)…

As I pointed out, this was a while back. Things might well have changed in the business these days. The lower order teams were "perceived" as being less likely to consistently finish, may have been a better way to have expressed my earlier comment. I don't think that all components are standardized. e.g. gearboxes? Again, I don't have any contact to the business anymore so I have no idea what it is like today.

Re: Everything Technical in F1

#59

Post by mtr »

ivanmaeder wrote: post #56

I don't remember and F1 story getting so popular on HN, the Austin GP has helped :) I think the sport is fascinating because it really is a battle of geek engineers and drivers. The most successful geek around today is this guy: http://en.espnf1.com/korea/motorsport/image/92108.html Normally the champagne can get stuck in your eyes. These guys and the huge teams behind them battle off track with each other and with t…

Kubica's accident at Montreal was very scary. I saw it unfold befor emy eyes and managed to snap a bunch of photos. Your post reminded me of this and inspired me to write a Thanksgiving/Racing Safety blog post: http://blog.octanenation.com/news/an-automotive-thanksgiving...

Exciting stuff!

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