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Changing times for web developers

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Re: Changing times for web developers

#21

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #12

"Changing times"? What exactly is he talking about? Many of the things he mentioned have been pretty standard, even among the least-knowledgeable web developers, for years now. jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now. Crockford's work is extremely well-know, as well, and has been for some time now. Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5. The times did change, but…

It's only changing times for those developers that used to get away with only knowing the bare minimum.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#22

Post by Volpe »

7. Progressive Enhancement.

It should be mentioned more, the current trend of tech is leaving it behind, for no good reason... There should at least be a debate on it... but it seems it's in the "Too hard" basket right now.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#23

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

mddw wrote: post #11

I'm always amazed to see how people who give advice (and good ones in this case) are totally unable to follow them on their websites. 296 http requests. 1.85mb transfered. Yslow grade D. So yeah, these are good advices. In fact, the OP should follow 'em if he wants to "survive".

Reminds me of that blog post on HN I saw about being responsive, which wasn't responsive...

Re: Changing times for web developers

#24

Post by czzarr »

edanm wrote: post #15

Does anyone have any recommendations for good REST books? For example, the book cited in the article - is it good? I understand the basics of REST, but I want to get a deeper understanding. Also, I still regularly encounter situations where I'm not sure what the "best" thing to do is (collections of items, linked items, etc. - how to represent this with REST?).

Steve Klabnik's is pretty good: http://designinghypermediaapis.com/

And there is this one http://www.amazon.com/Building-Hypermedia-APIs-HTML5-Node/dp... also which is longer but more detailed. You don't need to know anything about node to understand.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#25

Post by jasonlotito »

PommeDeTerre wrote: post #12

"Changing times"? What exactly is he talking about? Many of the things he mentioned have been pretty standard, even among the least-knowledgeable web developers, for years now. jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now. Crockford's work is extremely well-know, as well, and has been for some time now. Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5. The times did change, but…

> jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now.

One could probably assume you already know it. Right? =)

> Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5.

Being new and being widely practiced are two different things. Also, REST is something people still struggle with today, because they assumed they knew it because it's deceptively easy. And HTML5? Really? It takes just 10 seconds to scroll through the thread here and see how just because HTML5 is more than 6 months old doesn't mean everyone sees it as ready.

> but it looks like he's still just catching up with where the rest of us were years ago

The rest of who specifically? Not HN'ers, that's for sure. Not web developers. Who, specifically?

Re: Changing times for web developers

#26

Post by bbotond »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #21
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #12

"Changing times"? What exactly is he talking about? Many of the things he mentioned have been pretty standard, even among the least-knowledgeable web developers, for years now. jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now. Crockford's work is extremely well-know, as well, and has been for some time now. Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5. The times did change, but…

It's only changing times for those developers that used to get away with only knowing the bare minimum.

Which is most developers. Maybe you work with exceptionally well-informed and talented people but 90% of the web devs I know don't know squat about responsive and MVC frameworks, REST or how to optimize JS. And by "don't know" I mean they have never even heard of the concept, not just that they haven't had the time to learn about it. Sometimes I get funny looks for mentioning even jQuery or modernizr.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#27

Post by TazeTSchnitzel »

bbotond wrote: post #26
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's only changing times for those developers that used to get away with only knowing the bare minimum.

Which is most developers. Maybe you work with exceptionally well-informed and talented people but 90% of the web devs I know don't know squat about responsive and MVC frameworks, REST or how to optimize JS. And by "don't know" I mean they have never even heard of the concept, not just that they haven't had the time to learn about it. Sometimes I get funny looks for mentioning even jQuery or modernizr.

>Maybe you work with exceptionally well-informed and talented people

I don't. I'm not one myself, either. I have no familiarity with MVC frameworks, but I at least know what they are.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#28

Post by rymith »

Toshio wrote: post #14
mmaunder wrote: post #9

Agree with half, but don't worry about: JS MVC frameworks: MVC in JS is almost always overkill. HTML5: Most of the web doesn't have support for it yet. Optimization: Sure, but don't preoptimize so rather go looking for the tools once your app tells you it's slow. Also minified JS is great to save a tiny bit of bandwidth and obfuscate, but damn it's a pain to debug your live site.

> "HTML5: Most of the web doesn't have support for it yet." Say what? You probably meant to say "most of the internet explorer installed base doesn't have support for it" which is a far, far cry from "most of the web".

No, what he said was correct. Even my beloved chrome does not have 100% compliance. Now combine the incomplete implementations, coupled with the rate of browser adoption, HTML5 simply isn't ubiquitous for a number of years. So you will be looking at polyfills and excanvas scripts for the foreseeable future.

What he could have said was 100% of the web does not have 100% support for HTML5.

Re: Changing times for web developers

#29

Post by jfaucett »

jasonlotito wrote: post #25
PommeDeTerre wrote: post #12

"Changing times"? What exactly is he talking about? Many of the things he mentioned have been pretty standard, even among the least-knowledgeable web developers, for years now. jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now. Crockford's work is extremely well-know, as well, and has been for some time now. Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5. The times did change, but…

> jQuery has had pretty significant traction for 4 or so years now. One could probably assume you already know it. Right? =) > Minifying JavaScript and CSS files isn't new, nor are REST and HTML5. Being new and being widely practiced are two different things. Also, REST is something people still struggle with today, because they assumed they knew it because it's deceptively easy. And HTML5? Really? It takes just 10 s…

agree wholeheartedly about HTML5. Its a broad API with lots of loose parts, and frankly its not ready in the sense that I can take the specs, program an app in HTML5 and be confident that its gonna work. I'm pretty confident in saying no browser supports HTML5 100% - though I'd be happy if someone could prove me wrong :)

Re: Changing times for web developers

#30

Post by znowi »

What I like about web development is that it is always changing. Each day something new to learn and try. Those are nice tips, but hardly a revelation for the HN crowd. A bit surprised it's the top story.
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