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Deno 2.8

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Re: Deno 2.8

#11

Post by vmsp »

TingPing wrote: post #8
vmsp wrote: post #5

I wonder how Deno's faring. Node's the stable solution and will be with us forever. You can now use TypeScript with it and, soon enough, you'll be able to build your app to a single executable -- including native deps. Bun's chaotic but, nonetheless, it's _fast_ and it's taking an interesting approach by including everything in the stdlib. Plus, bought by Anthropic. Deno had an awesome story with the sandbox and ease…

> Plus, bought by Anthropic. Who thinks this is a positive?!

That wasn't a value judgment on the acquisition. I was just pointing out that it made the project more sustainable.

Re: Deno 2.8

#12

Post by kloop »

kayson wrote: post #10
cf100clunk wrote: post #4

Deno is a JavaScript and TypeScript runtime, for those who don't recognize the name. Here's a review of Deno 2.6 vs competitors Bun 1.3 and Node.js 25: https://www.devtoolreviews.com/reviews/bun-vs-node-vs-deno-2...

It's surprising to me that bun is so much faster serving web requests. The article mentions Zig as a factor, but is micromanaging memory really gaining over 2x vs node? Similarly, it seems, though they didnt exactly say, that they're running bun with a warm package cache... What about the others? Do they have caches?

> The article mentions Zig as a factor, but is micromanaging memory really gaining over 2x vs node?

As someone who has optimized by reducing/batching heap allocations, 2x seems within the realm of possibility, depending on the exact circumstances.

That being said, iirc, node also has more hooks for things like observability than bun does, which might hurt it here

Re: Deno 2.8

#13

Post by simonw »

TingPing wrote: post #8
vmsp wrote: post #5

I wonder how Deno's faring. Node's the stable solution and will be with us forever. You can now use TypeScript with it and, soon enough, you'll be able to build your app to a single executable -- including native deps. Bun's chaotic but, nonetheless, it's _fast_ and it's taking an interesting approach by including everything in the stdlib. Plus, bought by Anthropic. Deno had an awesome story with the sandbox and ease…

> Plus, bought by Anthropic. Who thinks this is a positive?!

It means they're a whole lot less likely to run out of money, which makes them a safer bet as a dependency.

Re: Deno 2.8

#14

Post by hobofan »

vmsp wrote: post #5

I wonder how Deno's faring. Node's the stable solution and will be with us forever. You can now use TypeScript with it and, soon enough, you'll be able to build your app to a single executable -- including native deps. Bun's chaotic but, nonetheless, it's _fast_ and it's taking an interesting approach by including everything in the stdlib. Plus, bought by Anthropic. Deno had an awesome story with the sandbox and ease…

They did lay off ~half the company ~2 months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47467746

Re: Deno 2.8

#15

Post by mohsen1 »

> Deno now defaults to npm:

This is an interesting development. npm after all is the de-facto ecosystem and leaning into it makes sense.

I'm wondering how Deno would've been received if it supported npm and package.json from day 1.

Re: Deno 2.8

#16

Post by neals »

vmsp wrote: post #5

I wonder how Deno's faring. Node's the stable solution and will be with us forever. You can now use TypeScript with it and, soon enough, you'll be able to build your app to a single executable -- including native deps. Bun's chaotic but, nonetheless, it's _fast_ and it's taking an interesting approach by including everything in the stdlib. Plus, bought by Anthropic. Deno had an awesome story with the sandbox and ease…

It's good to have some options, to prevent the ecosystem from stalling

Re: Deno 2.8

#17

Post by tarruda »

simonw wrote: post #13
TingPing wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Plus, bought by Anthropic. Who thinks this is a positive?!

It means they're a whole lot less likely to run out of money, which makes them a safer bet as a dependency.

> safer bet as a dependency.

The recent 1 million line vibe coded PR suggests it is not so reliable as a dependency.

Re: Deno 2.8

#18

Post by survirtual »

I wrap most node-isms and use deno as the runtime. Works well. If a project is pure typescript I just have deno run it. Extra options for security are great, installation scripts disabled by default, etc.

If you're using node directly, please stop. At a minimum use Bun.

With agentic work, there is little reason to use anything besides Rust and Typescript in any case. Room to disagree but type safety, memory safety, and a large corpus of work is critical. Agents need difficult errors and baked in patterns they navigate it easily. For UI, Typescript makes the most sense just because of the mass of design examples.

Re: Deno 2.8

#19

Post by allthetime »

simonw wrote: post #13
TingPing wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Plus, bought by Anthropic. Who thinks this is a positive?!

It means they're a whole lot less likely to run out of money, which makes them a safer bet as a dependency.

Running out of money is never the issue with a big company buying an open source project. There are countless examples of projects dying or changing significantly for the worse after acquisition.

Also “no human wrote any of this code” is not my personal benchmark for a reliable dependency.

Re: Deno 2.8

#20

Post by afavour »

mohsen1 wrote: post #15

> Deno now defaults to npm: This is an interesting development. npm after all is the de-facto ecosystem and leaning into it makes sense. I'm wondering how Deno would've been received if it supported npm and package.json from day 1.

I actually lost interest in Deno once it started leaning into NPM. I thought it was a bold and wise idea to make a clean break from the mess of Node and restart with a sensible ecosystem. Absent that... I'm just sticking with Node.
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