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The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

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Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#41

Post by rationalist »

richforrester wrote: post #34
mhb wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Courtesy of TFA and capitalism: "In 1985, if you were a reasonably affluent American, the best computer that you could afford was the IBM PC AT. The PC AT would cost you about $6,000—$19,400 in 2026 dollars—and thus represented about a quarter of the median American’s annual income; and it ran on an Intel 80286 processor, capable of something like 900,000 instructions per second. Today, if you find yourself in a mark…

That has little to do with what I said. A third of the world lives in poverty. That's the fault of capitalism.

> A third of the world lives in poverty. That's the fault of capitalism.

So what you're saying is that capitalism lifted about two thirds of the world out of poverty.

Thanks to capitalism, I don't have to toil in the fields.

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#42

Post by xbmcuser »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #15

What was most surprising about all this to me was this line: > So modern DRAM manufacturing is an extraordinarily complex and expensive process. Building a single state-of-the-art DRAM fabrication facility, a “fab,” will cost you about $15 to $20 billion; acquiring all the necessary equipment, like lithography tools and etching machines, will cost you another few billion; and then it’ll take you a few years of produc…

Part of this is a lie high prices for equipment has a lot to do with monopolies in the whole supply chain and one of the major reason I am rooting for China to get parity on node as that would mean it would have been able to break all the monopolies and we get competition on the whole production from uv machines, wafer, on equipment for storing etc. Renewables are rapidly taking the world to very cheap or free energy but it would be bad if the way to best use the energy for production is controlled by a few corporations

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#43

Post by cherioo »

aurareturn wrote: post #7

The MacBook Pro on which I’m writing this piece needs memory that can keep up with a powerful processor running many programs at once: so it uses a standard called DDR, “double data rate,” which runs at a reasonably high voltage and offers high bandwidth. The processor on my iPhone is less powerful, so it needs less data at any given moment; but voltage matters enormously, since every milliwatt allocated to memory is…

Maybe author is writing this from an Intel Mac!

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#44

Post by hackyhacky »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #40
hackyhacky wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Really? Who else builds stuff? Said the Christian in pre-Englightenment Europe: "Well, of course Christianity is the one true religion. After all, the whole civilized world is Christian."

That doesn't answer my question.

That's because your question is silly. I'll spell it out for you: Just because all modern states are capitalist does not mean that all states must be capitalist, as evidenced by the many erstwhile states that were not capitalist. Your failure to see beyond your immediate surroundings and ignoring the first sentence of my previous comment is perhaps the reason for your silly question.

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#45

Post by torben-friis »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #37
hackyhacky wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This quote has nothing to do with capitalism. Please note that "commerce" and "capitalism" are not synonymous, and that the former does not imply the latter. Capitalism is in no way a prerequisite for technological development.

Capitalism is in no way a prerequisite for technological development. Really? Who else builds stuff?

>Who else builds stuff?

The Chinese, famously?

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#46

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

It's impressive that somehow, as if by coincidence, we're seeing the biggest inflationary drivers for decades, perhaps for centuries, all happening simultaneously.

The Iran war is spiking the price of oil and will likely cause shortages of pretty much everything if it isn't ended.

The Ukraine war is helping with that by destroying Russian refining capacity.

The memory shortage is set to do the same to consumer electronics, which are absolutely essential to the modern economy.

Meanwhile the AI fad is seeing huge layoffs. At the same time as the AI Big Cos are beginning to show signs of ending the subsidised free lunch phase and moving to a utility model, which will raise prices for every company that is hooked on AI.

Also tariffs. Although I'm not sure if anyone knows what's happening there.

And farms are failing. Climate change will accelerate that, so there will be food shortages within a few years.

If it's not cynical and deliberate, it's an astounding confluence of (literally) catastrophic mismanagement.

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#47

Post by aurareturn »

cherioo wrote: post #43
aurareturn wrote: post #7

The MacBook Pro on which I’m writing this piece needs memory that can keep up with a powerful processor running many programs at once: so it uses a standard called DDR, “double data rate,” which runs at a reasonably high voltage and offers high bandwidth. The processor on my iPhone is less powerful, so it needs less data at any given moment; but voltage matters enormously, since every milliwatt allocated to memory is…

Maybe author is writing this from an Intel Mac!

Quite possible. He did say his “powerful” MacBook Pro CPU is faster than his iPhone.

I’m pretty sure even an iPhone 11 chip is more powerful than a 2019 MacBook Pro CPU in ST. An iPhone 15 is more powerful than the fastest 2019 MacBook Pro Intel CPU in MT.

I suppose he can be using a 2019 MacBook Pro or older and an iPhone 14 or older and compares only MT speeds.

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#48

Post by windowsrookie »

aurareturn wrote: post #7

The MacBook Pro on which I’m writing this piece needs memory that can keep up with a powerful processor running many programs at once: so it uses a standard called DDR, “double data rate,” which runs at a reasonably high voltage and offers high bandwidth. The processor on my iPhone is less powerful, so it needs less data at any given moment; but voltage matters enormously, since every milliwatt allocated to memory is…

Apple has been using LPDDR in the MacBooks since at least 2015. I remember it was one of the complaint of the 2016-2017 MacBook Pros. They were still using LPDDR3 because LPDDR4 wasn't ready for production yet (despite regular DDR4 being available). The 2018 MacBook Pro's finally switched to LPDDR4.

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#49

Post by m463 »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #15

What was most surprising about all this to me was this line: > So modern DRAM manufacturing is an extraordinarily complex and expensive process. Building a single state-of-the-art DRAM fabrication facility, a “fab,” will cost you about $15 to $20 billion; acquiring all the necessary equipment, like lithography tools and etching machines, will cost you another few billion; and then it’ll take you a few years of produc…

> Apple in particular has $20B in its couch cushions

I wonder how long it REALLY took them to move from intel to apple silicon, which they don't even make.

It might be easy, like a consumer deciding to generate their own electricity (pv on the roof)

or it might be slightly harder, like a consumer deciding to generate their own electricity by drilling for oil, refining it, etc...

Re: The memory shortage is causing a repricing of consumer electronics

#50

Post by hackyhacky »

rationalist wrote: post #41
richforrester wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That has little to do with what I said. A third of the world lives in poverty. That's the fault of capitalism.

> A third of the world lives in poverty. That's the fault of capitalism. So what you're saying is that capitalism lifted about two thirds of the world out of poverty. Thanks to capitalism, I don't have to toil in the fields.

> Thanks to capitalism, I don't have to toil in the fields.

No, that's thanks to commerce not to capitalism. Capitalism benefits those those who hold capital, which is not me.

The fact that there are more than enough resources for no one to live in poverty should suggest to you that something is wrong with the distribution system.

"It's true, Mr/Ms Rationalist, that our patented Miracle Medical Snakeoil caused a third of your leg to become necrotic and fall off, but be glad for the two thirds that did not fall off!"

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