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AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

axelk.ee

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Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#311

Post by Jtarii »

nehal3m wrote: post #253
deaton wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an incredibly naive view of intellectual property. If you cannot own things you create, there is little incentive to create and share those things. Do you think any of your favorite movies and TV shows ever get made without copyright protections? Of course not, because money needs to change hands for those things to be funded.

This is naive in the opposite. Creators gonna create.

Who is giving a creator millions of dollars to create something if there is no guaranteed path to recouping production costs.

Are we going the communist soviet union route where everything is decided by central committee?

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#312

Post by echoangle »

fulafel wrote: post #217
oytmeal wrote: post #128

Isn't plagiarism inherently unauthorized?

If we go by the dictionary definition "Plagiarism means using someone else’s work without giving them proper credit" then I'll bet in art authorized plagiarism has historically been a common occurrence, for example.

If it's authorized, I would argue that the credit you give is the proper credit, even if it is nothing at all.

If you ask me if you can reproduce my works without giving credit and I say yes, I don't think you're using my work without giving proper credit.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#313

Post by gagan2020 »

tancop wrote: post #171

if theres just one good thing coming out of ai its breaking copyright law forever. no one should be able to "own" ideas. royalties for commercial use is another thing and i support it but what we know as (non commercial) piracy and unlicensed fan art should be 100% legal

Can we do that for Medical field?

Like if we know formulation of drug then drug (+ any smaller modification - through AI) could be new formulation. That will break current Medical patent system.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#314

Post by matt_kantor »

hparadiz wrote: post #242
matt_kantor wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, don't let pesky discussions about ethics get in the way of building cool stuff. I'm working on paving over the Amazon rainforest so I can build the world's largest roller coaster, but for some reason people keep trying to talk me out of it. Good thing I have this bucket of sand to put my head in so I can tune them out.

You assume that I think using language models is unethical. I do not agree that it is. Now what?

The argument that you're ignoring is about whether they're ethical or not. Your priors may land you on either side of that argument, but ideally you're willing to have your mind changed if the other side makes a strong enough case.

But intentionally blinding yourself to the debate and plowing ahead anyway (which is how I interpreted your parent comment) sounds like willful ignorance.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#315

Post by LatencyKills »

echoangle wrote: post #307
LatencyKills wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm trained on protected works. That someone, at some point, paid for. I'd like to understand why I can't use a song in one of my videos without permission/payment, but an AI company can train models using that song without having either. I'm not anti-AI. I'd just like to see companies play by the rules everyone else has to follow.

> I'd like to understand why I can't use a song in one of my videos without permission/payment, but an AI company can train models using that song without having either. Because training isn't redistribution. You can also listen to the song and make a new one that sounds similar, just like the AI can.

To do that training, you must first obtain the item with the content you require. Did OpenAI purchase a copy of every book they trained their models on?

Answer: They did not. That is literally why there are dozens of ongoing lawsuits in progress.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#316

Post by kube-system »

saghm wrote: post #302
kube-system wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, well it isn't in the US. Theft and copyright violations are entirely distinct laws here.

Sure, but you'd also have a pretty different experience with the law if you committed a bank heist or stole a cheap TV from a neighbor. I don't think the exact law that an action might violate is an important a distinction as what society chooses to do to punish or reward people who take certain actions, and US law does have some pretty harsh penalties for certain IP law violations that stem pretty directly from the…

Yeah, different laws have different penalties. IP laws also have exceptions that other laws don't have.

Teachers can, for example, photocopy things to teach their students, but they can't steal pencils from the store.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#317

Post by nehal3m »

Jtarii wrote: post #311
nehal3m wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is naive in the opposite. Creators gonna create.

Who is giving a creator millions of dollars to create something if there is no guaranteed path to recouping production costs. Are we going the communist soviet union route where everything is decided by central committee?

That is not the only scale to create on. Also, Linux is free. There’s more than one way to make something available.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#318

Post by jayd16 »

hparadiz wrote: post #242
matt_kantor wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, don't let pesky discussions about ethics get in the way of building cool stuff. I'm working on paving over the Amazon rainforest so I can build the world's largest roller coaster, but for some reason people keep trying to talk me out of it. Good thing I have this bucket of sand to put my head in so I can tune them out.

You assume that I think using language models is unethical. I do not agree that it is. Now what?

That's what the sand bucket was about.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#319

Post by WarmWash »

zetanor wrote: post #224
WarmWash wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's never been a problem with people ad-blocking for the last 20 years, why is it suddenly a problem now? We've been celebrating denying creators revenue for decades... Maybe this is just the internet hypocricy of "When I do it, it's good, when they do it, it's bad".

I am in favor of severely limiting both copyright and advertising, but for the benefit of everyone, not just for the benefit of a few "AI" companies.

The answer is to simply pay for stuff.

There is no viable model where "have stuff but not pay for it" works out.

Re: AI is just unauthorised plagiarism at a bigger scale

#320

Post by seandoe »

Jtarii wrote: post #306
enraged_camel wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> If you cannot own things you create, there is little incentive to create and share those things. You do realize people created and shared things long before copyright became a thing, right?

Can you explain how something like the Lord of the Rings film series gets created in a world with no IP laws.

Many versions are made, the best ones get the most views. You don't need huge budgets and guaranteed revenue to make great art. In fact, I'd argue it's often the opposite. Most big budget movies suck these days.
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