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Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

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Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#171

Post by sidewndr46 »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #93
Arubis wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a sane, fair, and (crucially) long-term stable system, persons given privilege and authority over others are subject to a higher standard for their own behavior. The long-running US trend of the inverse (additional legal protections for positions of authority) is incredibly destructive. This is a moral and values judgment, yes, but it's not just that -- it communicates to the population at large that they should f…

One of the worst examples in the US is the consequence asymmetry for speech. Law enforcement and federal agents can lie as much as they like with impunity when dealing with citizens, but (a) it's a federal crime to lie to a federal officer (18 US Code § 1001, up to 8 years imprisonment), and (b) truly, anything you say to law enforcement when under any suspicion can and will be used against you in a court of law, eve…

This distinction doesn't make sense. A police officer's job is to lie to you. Are we expecting jailtime for doing their job?

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#172

Post by ceejayoz »

ikeboy wrote: post #160
caconym_ wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not suggesting that "maybe we're overcriminalized". You are suggesting that we should not hold law enforcement accountable for egregious abuses of power that do real harm to real people. You think it should not be considered criminal for a police officer to put somebody in prison (under threat of bodily harm or death, by default) just because they feel like it, or whatever. You think police officers should be…

I haven't said those things. Rape and murder are existing crimes, and they should be applied equally to police officers. I think that the core problem with the system is not individual bad actors, but overcriminalization and the acceptance of that by judges and juries. To solve that you need actual reform, and adding a new crime that would inevitably be weaponized is not the way. The whole concept of holding people "…

> Rape and murder are existing crimes, and they should be applied equally to police officers.

How about kidnapping and false imprisonment, as in this case?

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#173

Post by ImJamal »

adampunk wrote: post #158
okeuro49 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK 30 people are arrested a day for social media posts online. Only about 10 percent resulting in convictions. Police don't face criminal charges for this. https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arr...

That’s not Europe. They had a whole vote about it and everything!

Europe is a continent which the UK is a part of.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#174

Post by ceejayoz »

epolanski wrote: post #137

Why's everyone picking (rightfully) on the sheriff alone and ignoring that he got a legal warrant from a judge, and that the defendant was then later kept in prison by a judge?

That'll be because of this bit:

> Weems admitted in a later interview that he knew at the time of the arrest that Larry’s Facebook post was a pre-existing meme that referred to an actual shooting that took place in a different state, over 500 miles away. But Weems and Morrow left out that extremely important context from their warrant application.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#175

Post by mindslight »

ikeboy wrote: post #32
ceejayoz wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The system needs to change so pursuing frivolous or weak charges doesn't work. Agreed. Cases this knowingly frivolous, for example, should be treated as the criminal kidnapping or false imprisonment it would be if any other citizen perpetrated it.

How is that an example? Whatever you do now doesn't work retroactively. Changing the system means removing the potential for abuse of power, not punishing abuse of power after the fact.

> Changing the system means removing the potential for abuse of power, not punishing abuse of power after the fact.

At a certain point, punishing abuse of power after the fact is the only way to discourage the potential abuse of power. Like there is nothing that actually stops you or me from going and kidnapping someone. And that same dynamic applies to someone who happens to also be a sheriff who controls a jail due to his employment. There is no magic wand for the system to wave that makes it so that the individuals employed by that system can't simply break the law.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#176

Post by loeg »

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #168
okeuro49 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the UK 30 people are arrested a day for social media posts online. Only about 10 percent resulting in convictions. Police don't face criminal charges for this. https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arr...

Those 30 aren’t arrested for just for writing “social media posts” but for possibly “harmful communication including incitement to terrorism and violence, online threats and abuse, and unwanted communication via email and other means” Of the 90% many will accept their fault and receive a caution or warning Edit: and none of those cases would involve pretrial remand/jail

The vast majority of those arrested are just for mild insults, which are illegal under the censorious UK regime; not incitement to terrorism or threats.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#177

Post by sidewndr46 »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #88
contubernio wrote: post #28

The sheriff that arrested him should face criminal charges for misuse of authority. That he doesn't reflects a structural weakness in US law. In most European legal systems a law enforcement officer overstepping his legal authority would face criminal charges for it.

The Sheriff absolutely should face some consequences, at least to his career. The money paid to Bushart ultimately is no skin off the government's back. It's taxpayer money, they will just underfund a good thing, raise taxes, or print debt to pay it if there's a shortfall. It'd be an interesting thing to see garnishing of wages, deductions from pension funds, or loss of some kind of bonus system to help balance the s…

I highly doubt Tennessee is going to start printing USD.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#178

Post by Analemma_ »

LastTrain wrote: post #107
Supermancho wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"In return, Bushart will drop the federal civil rights lawsuit he filed against Sheriff Nick Weems, investigator Jason Morrow and the county for violating his constitutional rights." Even at his age of 60 (I'm getting up there), I wouldn't have made that deal. https://www.newschannel5.com/news/newschannel-5-investigates...

Under today’s administration and courts a federal lawsuit like that was going nowhere anyway, except maybe an executive order praising the Sheriff.

"Thrown out due to Qualified [read: absolute] Immunity"

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#179

Post by Kapura »

contubernio wrote: post #28

The sheriff that arrested him should face criminal charges for misuse of authority. That he doesn't reflects a structural weakness in US law. In most European legal systems a law enforcement officer overstepping his legal authority would face criminal charges for it.

i don't know if you've seen how american law is faring; the supreme court recently legalized racism as long as it's partisan.

Re: Tennessee man jailed 37 days for Trump meme wins settlement after lawsuit

#180

Post by sidewndr46 »

mandevil wrote: post #83
vitally3643 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a structural weakness, it's an intentional feature . Our legislature specifically and intentionally made it impossible for citizens (or anyone) to hold police responsible for anything.

Not the legislature: the Supreme Court. Qualified Immunity was created out of whole cloth by the Supreme Court back in the 1960's when a police officer arrested- and then a judge convicted- a group of black and white Episcopal priests for "making a disturbance of the peace"- that is, having black and white people out in public together as equals. This was Pierson v. Ray, decided by the Supreme Court in 1967. The curr…

Isn't it way more narrow than what you're saying? For New Mexico's cases it only applies to civil rights violations. If the police officer just for example kills someone in the line of duty, he still has qualified immunity
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