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Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

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Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#461

Post by gpvos »

CodesInChaos wrote: post #184
mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

> iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work Is it? I see it more as an underwhelming fix for SEPA Direct Debit's inability to verify payment data synchronously. * iDeal doesn't support basic features like pre-authorization. I'm not even sure if it supports setting up a payment agreement without triggering an immediate payment at all (pretty sure it didn't, when we inte…

No. The bank gives you a prominent notification when someone new gets a direct debit authorization for your account. And a merchant gets banned quickly when they misuse their debit authorization.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#462

Post by throwaway2037 »

cfontes wrote: post #60
mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

PIX from Brazil is even better, to be honest. But this is a big improvement over online CC payment. I lived in the NL and Brazil, so I can compare the two, and while iDEAL is pretty good, PIX is easier to understand, explain, and deal with. PIX has more variants, you can use it for recurrent payment, split payments, financing, cashout and almost all things a CC can do nowadays. I would say Tikkie is almost as good an…

This is a brilliant response. I love personal anecdotes like this that meaningfully contribute to a better conversation on HN.

First: PIX sounds insanely good! I wish I had it where I live.

My follow-up question: Can anyone with experience with India's Unified Payments Interface (UPI) comment about capabilities compared to PIX? It is frequently lauded as one of the best e/mobile payment services in the (developing) world.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#463

Post by Balooga »

SoftTalker wrote: post #366
Forgeties79 wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amex is regularly rejected by businesses and cannot be your only credit card, so really you maybe have Discover. I also wouldn’t say either of those is particularly better than Visa/Mastercard. They all engage in the same practices more or less

The only places I've found that refuse AMEX are very small mom and pop operations. And of those, many don't accept cards of any type: cash only.

Costco?

[Edit] -- And I've frequented several independent coffee shops that are cashless.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#464

Post by intuxikated »

mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

I thought it was an EU wide version of the belgian PayConiq

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#465

Post by izacus »

HunOL wrote: post #95

The title is definitely an over-exaggeration. "Goodbye" will happen when Europeans going abroad no longer need to take Visa or Mastercard cards with them. What is currently happening is the solving of instant cross-border P2P transfers, which sounds like a very niche problem. Online payments are mostly a solved problem because payment gateways like Adyen or Stripe already support local payment systems.

Even if Visa/MC keep the fee on foreign spending, losing domestic spending will be a massive financial loss for them (and big gain for EU markets).

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#466

Post by nozzlegear »

swed420 wrote: post #180
nozzlegear wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just more trite "Muh both sides" doomerism.

No it isn't. It's safe to assume you've either drunk the kool-aid or have something to gain monetarily (even if falsely assumed) by allowing the illusion to persist. Either way, you're literally part of the problem, as is anyone else who still takes this system seriously.

> It's safe to assume you've either drunk the kool-aid or have something to gain monetarily (even if falsely assumed) by allowing the illusion to persist. Either way, you're literally part of the problem, as is anyone else who still takes this system seriously.

Is it? Am I? As a former Sanders caucuser who didn't fall for his supporters' both sides bullshit, perhaps some self-reflection on why running a candidate who's only popular with white people in Iowa would inevitably lose is in order.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#467

Post by jeroenhd »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #284
jeroenhd wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In some countries there is a payment system that works by generating QR codes at checkout and scanning those with your phone. I don't know if Wero intends to also support those, but it could make for a direct integration into live checkout. I think the Digital Euro initiative is closer to replacing contactless payments than Wero is, but it'll depend on the country I think.

IMHO, QR codes are a big step back from contactless and appeared in countries that didn't have widespread card adoption (e.g. China),

I don't think it's as big of an issue. China seems to be doing just fine when it comes to payment processing, and it's not the only country that works that way.

From a software freedom perspective, I actually prefer QR codes. The UX of tapping a card is a little better (though it also opens up an avenue for theft) but I think every phone I've held the past ten years has had some way to quickly scan a QR code from the lock screen, even if not every phone made the possibility obvious.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#470

Post by Fnoord »

Lionga wrote: post #310
surgical_fire wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly trust the EU a lot more than I trust US corporations.

Considering the head of EZB is a convicted criminal with, lets call it interesting, letters to the convicted criminal Sarkozy I am not sure what is plague and what cholera.

Lets see. Gerhard Schroeder, fled to RU. Nicolas Sarkozy, convicted. Silvio Berlusconi, convicted. Geert Wilders, convicted. Slobodan Milošević, convicted. Jean-Marie Le Pen, convicted. Marine Le Pen, convicted.

Donald Trump, convicted (pardoned everyone who attempted a coup on Jan 6 2021).

Victor Orban, surely he'll get convicted.

Benjamin N., Vladimir P.: wanted by ICC.

(This excludes cases like Jan Maršálek / Wirecard fraud / GRU spy. Also, have a peak at all the cleaning Zelenski's government had to do, including in his inner circle.)

Seems we in Europe at least are attempting to uphold the rule of law. I can't say the same for US corporations or US government, given the current administration. That being said... can we stop voting for these narcissistic criminals? Thank you in advance.

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