Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

lesnumeriques.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

321–330 of 811 posts

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#321

Post by mrb »

tlogan wrote: post #179

So this is basically the EU version of Zelle? Basically a way to transfer money between parties who already have established trust. Am I understanding that correctly? But I am confused about how this relates to Visa and Mastercard. Those systems are used for payments between parties that have not necessarily established trust.

Yes Wero and Zelle are similar: real-time payment systems, where money is sent directly from bank account to bank account, and recipients are looked up with a convenient ID (a phone number, or an email).

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#322

Post by carlosjobim »

al_borland wrote: post #193

What does this mean for travel if Visa is not “everywhere you want to be”? I can’t tell if this is going to replace Visa/Mastercard or be offered in addition to Visa/Mastercard to handle transactions for locals while still allowing transactions to be viable for everyone else who might be passing through.

It means that businesses who accept cards will have a great advantage against businesses who think they are smart by making life difficult for customers.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#323

Post by lxgr »

abdullahkhalids wrote: post #100
mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

Banks and Visa/Mastercard probably love that you fill out your CC details on an online store, and next time you can just 1-click pay. Probably causes a big jump in revenue/profit. That's why they never innovated much. Of course, it is incorrect, and digital payments everywhere (on a kiosk or online) should be intentional pushes, not pulls.

I want many payments to be pull-based (at least I'd go crazy having to positively sign off every utility bill and subscription), but the ideal user interface for pull payments shows who exactly is pulling what, with a few days notice, and a one-click way to cancel any standing authorization.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#324

Post by Filligree »

surgical_fire wrote: post #279
moralestapia wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brazil is on the West, fyi.

West is just the US nowadays.

I would say West is Europe, Japan and a few others. But I think I need a new word for that one.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#325

Post by lxgr »

andix wrote: post #313
lxgr wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If 3DS and chip + PIN card usage were ubiquitous, the value of a stolen card number and even card would be zero, and this entire problem would go away. Unfortunately, legacy deployments have just proven too pervasive to effect real change, even with substantial incentives, especially in early card adopting markets such as the US.

Aren't they ubiquitous and required at least for 5-10 years now?

The US essentially uses neither 3DS nor PINs.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#326

Post by 1234letshaveatw »

chneu wrote: post #258
Waterluvian wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One silver lining of the current U.S. regime's behaviour is how it's forcing us to move out of the local minima of over-Americanization that we've been stuck in for too long.

As an American, I'm so glad America is finally crumbling from its position of power. Americans need a wake up call because our insane hubris and stubbornness is responsible for so much of the bad stuff in the world.

Another American here, I find these self loathing kind of posts to be so sophomoric and embarrassing

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#327

Post by roysting »

SomeUserName432 wrote: post #219
cfontes wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PIX from Brazil is even better, to be honest. But this is a big improvement over online CC payment. I lived in the NL and Brazil, so I can compare the two, and while iDEAL is pretty good, PIX is easier to understand, explain, and deal with. PIX has more variants, you can use it for recurrent payment, split payments, financing, cashout and almost all things a CC can do nowadays. I would say Tikkie is almost as good an…

> PIX from Brazil is even better, to be honest. You lack the inherent fraud, bankruptcy and other malicious actor protection that Visa/Mastercard provides. Bought something online and didn't receive your product? With PIX you're SOL, with Visa/Mastercard you get a chargeback.

Thats a good argument but those are also features that could be provided by the force of government power in a government and country where the government is not and has not intentionally been corrupted, partially for the very purpose of preventing something like digital cash that is anonymous just like cash was before people foolishly gave in to the “convenience” of cards and acting like they had money by using credit cards.

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#328

Post by legends2k »

hirako2000 wrote: post #79
mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

In fact a unique payment ID (e.g QR) to "push" payment is even safer. No redirect. That's how payment should be. Not an authorization given to pull from us, but the agency for us to push the amount.

This is exactly what India's UPI (Unified Payments Interface) works. No PII, just a UPI ID is given and the user gets a push notification in Android/iOS app for approval (with PIN or security enclave like fingerprint).

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#329

Post by [deleted] »

mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

[deleted]

Re: Goodbye Visa and Mastercard: 130M Europeans switching to sovereign payment

#330

Post by jorisw »

gonzalohm wrote: post #232
mcv wrote: post #43

Wero is basically an EU-wide version of the Dutch iDeal system, which in my opinion is the gold standard of how internet payment should work. I shouldn't have to fill in any card numbers on the site of the merchant (which is unsafe). Instead, the payment should redirect me to my bank, where I authorize the payment through my own bank's security system. I've always been annoyed by the need to type in sensitive card in…

How does the website know which bank to redirect to?

A dropdown is offered and the choice is remembered.
Post reply on HN