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The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

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Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#121

Post by ck45 »

tormeh wrote: post #112
hash872 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The government should just regulate it, control purity and production and let people access small amounts for recreation/performance Famously, the US spent about 15-20 years attempting this with opioids. They were widely available to people via a pseudo-medical process, or via secondhand dealing. Opioids were/are manufactured by regulated, publicly traded companies with inspectors who controlled purity and productio…

Not every drug is an opioid. We have prohibition laws designed for opioids blindly applied to any (in the western context) nontraditional drug. The German law on drugs is literally called "the painkiller law", for instance.

It’s not, the BtmG literally means narcotics drugs act. https://www.bfarm.de/EN/Federal-Opium-Agency/Narcotic-drugs/... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcotic_Drugs_Act

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#122

Post by fc417fc802 »

aoeusnth1 wrote: post #104
chadgpt3 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it the government's job to enforce people's teeth? I presume you also observed something worse than that but chose not to write about it?

I believe they were using their teeth (or lack thereof) to reference their visible meth addiction. See GP, "2) meth is neurodegenerative. heavy users end up with a permanent disability."

Of course the prohibition is what leads to the loss of teeth. Methamphetamine impacts salivation much more commonly and to a greater extent than amphetamine does. But meth is the cheap and accessible option due to the law.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#123

Post by fc417fc802 »

ptrl600 wrote: post #70

Ephedrine isn't banned, not even behind a prescription, there's just rather strict limits on how much you can buy a month. I take a Bronkaid every morning with my coffee.

I have to ask, why are you consuming (pseudo?)ephedrine every morning?

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#124

Post by fc417fc802 »

bbor wrote: post #86
zephen wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the only thing society is really good at with regards to drugs is prohibition. Really? Seems to me that, in general, we suck at it.

It does feel like that sometimes, but alcohol use plummeted during US prohibition.

If we carpet bomb a city and there's nothing left, does that count as a good job suppressing the guerilla insurgents? It's effective, sure ... although I don't know that drug prohibition has been particularly effective either.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#125

Post by thrownthatway »

Aurornis wrote: post #106
KarlKode wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a astronomically better example would be programs in the Netherlands, Denmark or Switzerland, where people heavily addicted to heroine can get into programs that will provide them with pharmaceutical heroine. Still prescribed by doctors (although specialized ones), but not just for pulling a wisdom tooth with huge margins for the Sacklers...

The last time I looked up the Swiss program it was only servicing a small number of people. Around 1500 in a country if 9 million. It also wasn’t prescribed like a typical medication but part of a program where they received other treatment as well. There was some exception where some people could get 2 days of it at a time to take home, but it wasn’t a free for all prescription where they could just talk to a doctor…

> a small number of people. Around 1500 in a country of 9 million.

What is this supposed to mean?

That’s a completely nonsense statement to make because you’ve provided no data on problem opioid use in Switzerland.

Is 1500 a lot? Not many? Average? Should all nine million be on the program?

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#126

Post by thrownthatway »

thrownthatway wrote: post #85
hash872 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The government should just regulate it, control purity and production and let people access small amounts for recreation/performance Famously, the US spent about 15-20 years attempting this with opioids. They were widely available to people via a pseudo-medical process, or via secondhand dealing. Opioids were/are manufactured by regulated, publicly traded companies with inspectors who controlled purity and productio…

There are 193 countries, plus the Holy See.

Why the down votes? There aren’t 300 countries.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#127

Post by nswango »

chadgpt3 wrote: post #101
hash872 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The government should just regulate it, control purity and production and let people access small amounts for recreation/performance Famously, the US spent about 15-20 years attempting this with opioids. They were widely available to people via a pseudo-medical process, or via secondhand dealing. Opioids were/are manufactured by regulated, publicly traded companies with inspectors who controlled purity and productio…

What if they were legal but hard to get? Say, we stop/arresting for possession or use in private, stop giving dealers and producers harsh sentences, but still give them moderate to weak sentences, stop proactively searching for dealers and producers, allow companies to produce with strict KYC, and don't allow retail sale in stores?

In California weed is legal but highly regulated. It's easy to buy weed in the legal market but very difficult to be licensed to sell or grow it.

The result is that the illegal market dwarfs the legal market. The legal suppliers simply can't compete with efficient and untaxed illegal or grey market sellers.

Note that the consumers who choose the illegal market are not in general socially excluded, habitual criminals or broken down addicts. Weed is widespread in almost all parts of society and probably less prevalent along dirt poor, mentally unwell or homeless drug users, who favour fent or meth.

People with jobs and houses choose illegal weed because it's both cheaper and easier to get hold of.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#128

Post by tormeh »

ck45 wrote: post #121
tormeh wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not every drug is an opioid. We have prohibition laws designed for opioids blindly applied to any (in the western context) nontraditional drug. The German law on drugs is literally called "the painkiller law", for instance.

It’s not, the BtmG literally means narcotics drugs act. https://www.bfarm.de/EN/Federal-Opium-Agency/Narcotic-drugs/... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcotic_Drugs_Act

The meaning has drifted, appropriately enough. Betäubungsmittel originally meant painkillers, as you can tell from the word. It's just that now every recreational drug is labeled as such.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#129

Post by fc417fc802 »

meowkit wrote: post #12
LocalH wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Human society has a massive issue with blindness towards n-order effects (they barely consider second-order effects, never mind thinking further out)

I don't think its innate though - most people I've met can think of higher order consequences or at least understand them. The real issue is actually measuring results. I think we have to design society to factor higher order effects in. That means a fundamentally new approach to things like voting and tracking accountability. Is it even possible? Who knows. Sometimes I think our problems have outstripped individual…

People only see them when they're being objective. My impression is that most people spend most of their time worrying about social status and engaging in tribalism meaning society on the whole is either blind to them or more likely will make up an answer that suits them.

Re: The main thing about P2P meth is that there's so much of it (2021)

#130

Post by nswango »

bhotka wrote: post #75
ghthor wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chronic Back pain is correlated with emotional trauma. The physical body is a mere projection of the energetic and spiritual being. This is wahy meditative spiritual practices such as yoga and taiji are good for chronic pain, as the physical pain is a mere projection of a deeper trauma that needs released.

how does my spiritual wellness affect the mechanical structure of my lower back?

I mean tons of back pain is medically unexplained. It's not like physiology has a perfect record here that can be used to dismiss alternative theories.
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