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Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

blogs.computerworld.com

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Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#51

Post by nandemo »

kragen wrote: post #24
narag wrote: post #3

From the article: So I said, "Cuba has an important resource - lots of people who have never learned to use Windows. And here you are, destroying that resource, gratuitously. If you are not ready yet to switch these clubs so that they teach people free software, at least you should shut them down until they can." Does he say this seriously? I've seen people using this kind of hyperbole when in a partisan environment…

It's completely serious. Stallman thinks the social harm done by proprietary software licenses is greater than the good done by the ability to use the software. Do you think that's an unreasonable or laughable position? The consequence that it is better to close down the clubs than to let them encourage proprietary software usage is almost inescapable given the above premise.

It is unreasonable.

Just imagine the amount of wealth that has been created in the past couple of decades by using proprietary software.

Though one could argue the same could have been done with free software, he's saying (as you paraphrase) that it's better to have no progress at all than to have progress at the cost of using proprietary.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#52

Post by electromagnetic »

anamax wrote: post #15
electromagnetic wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An illustration of this point is that in the UK the regulations for electricians, and building contractors in general, actually promotes small companies. They're usually either a two-man team or a father-son op. In fact the largest I ever saw was a three man team, which was a two-man team with one of their sons. The point is, is that the regulations actually keep the income evenly disbursed. Essentially everyone is e…

> The companies actually run a scam, they hire people who aren't certified electricians, which is perfectly acceptable and legal. However they'll never train them to be certified, they just use already-certified electricians to certify everyone's work is done correctly. Again this is unfair on the certified electricians because if anyone screws up and he doesn't catch it, he's liable and that can include a prison sen…

Certainly possible, but the difference is is that regulatory capture by small biz creates an even playing field and can prevent dominance, however when big biz does it you end up with few choices and extreme difficulty.

I mean this is quite an ironic example of regulation in big business. I mean look at the Big Three in automobile manufacturing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Three_(automobile_manufactu.... Now which one did I mean?

Look at what happened in the UK, the companies were making an inferior product (not many British car enthusiasts would agree, but I've managed to have a look in a few of the old cars and motorbikes and they're shoddy. Some old British bikes had the serious problem that they'd drip oil in front of the driving wheel). What happened? Well all three became one, that one became nationalized, that one ended up getting handed between multiple companies before being renamed to the Rover brand and ultimately ended up as part of Ford. Who won out in the UK for vehicles? All the more efficient foreign ones.

What's happening in the US? Well Ford seems pretty stable despite the crisis. Chrysler says they seriously doubted they'd make it past 2009 without outside help. GM was planning to merge with Chrysler, however now GM is up shit creek without a paddle and are hoping subsidies will help them survive. If Chrysler and GM get significantly weakened, well Ford will likely buy them out. Can anyone see where this could potentially go?

I think the serious problem with big biz, is that when there's problems an entire industry can move to a different country. The only US owned car manufacturer in 10-20 years could be Tesla motors probably only because a bunch of silicone valley guys understand the importance of competition.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#53

Post by corentin »

kragen wrote: post #45
corentin wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearly all the professional applications (engineering, finance, accounting, etc.) only run on Windows (or Mac OS X for the design stuff).

A surprising amount of it works under WINE, actually.

Yeah, that's the good thing about stable APIs and ABIs.

But why bother?

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#54

Post by katz »

kragen wrote: post #25
jacoblyles wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Business freedoms lead to human rights and general well-being. Having a thriving private economy gives people choice over their profession. Increased wealth means people have more choice over their lives. Cuba legalized the private purchase of cell phones and computers in 2008, but most people are far too poor to buy one. If that were to change, it would be a clear improvement in Cubans' lives. Let us not forget the…

While it is true that increased wealth means that people have more choice in their lives, it does not necessarily follow that business freedoms lead to general well-being or to what is normally understood as human rights. As a matter of history, there have been very many places and times where business was relatively unrestricted, while labor and political activity were tightly regulated, and where the wealth from bu…

Chile is one of the best South American countries. It has a lot less poverty than its more socialist neighbours. Here is a quite from WP:

> Currently, Chile is one of South America's most stable and prosperous nations.[5] Within the greater Latin American context it leads in terms of human development, competitiveness, quality of life, political stability, globalization, economic freedom, low perception of corruption and comparatively low poverty rates.[7] It also ranks high regionally in freedom of the press and democratic development.

During the Pinochet era the economy grew and created a stable base for the current day Chile. The economic policies of Chile has not changed course from the Pinochet era.

> and some parts of mainland China

China is screwed up and has many problems. When you compare China now with China pre-1978 you will see that people are a lot richer and more well off than they were then.

> Singapore

Compare Singapore with its neighbour Malaysia. Singapore has a high GDI and a lot less social problems than most other countries.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#55

Post by Maascamp »

katz wrote: post #54
kragen wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While it is true that increased wealth means that people have more choice in their lives, it does not necessarily follow that business freedoms lead to general well-being or to what is normally understood as human rights. As a matter of history, there have been very many places and times where business was relatively unrestricted, while labor and political activity were tightly regulated, and where the wealth from bu…

Chile is one of the best South American countries. It has a lot less poverty than its more socialist neighbours. Here is a quite from WP: > Currently, Chile is one of South America's most stable and prosperous nations.[5] Within the greater Latin American context it leads in terms of human development, competitiveness, quality of life, political stability, globalization, economic freedom, low perception of corruption…

So all the torture, repression, and extreme poverty during the Pinochet era was worth is huh? And there HAS been socialist change since Pinochet. I can't believe you'd hold Chili under Pinochet up as an example of what to do. Good lord.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#56

Post by anamax »

electromagnetic wrote: post #52
anamax wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The companies actually run a scam, they hire people who aren't certified electricians, which is perfectly acceptable and legal. However they'll never train them to be certified, they just use already-certified electricians to certify everyone's work is done correctly. Again this is unfair on the certified electricians because if anyone screws up and he doesn't catch it, he's liable and that can include a prison sen…

Certainly possible, but the difference is is that regulatory capture by small biz creates an even playing field and can prevent dominance, however when big biz does it you end up with few choices and extreme difficulty. I mean this is quite an ironic example of regulation in big business. I mean look at the Big Three in automobile manufacturing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Three_(automobile_manufactu... . Now wh…

> Certainly possible, but the difference is is that regulatory capture by small biz creates an even playing field and can prevent dominance

Except in practice this form merely creates inefficiency that the rest of us get to pay for.

Regulatory capture works to the advantage of the incumbents vs the rest of us, independent of the characteristics of the incumbents.

Me - I don't care about the incumbents, big or small. I see no reason why they should get govt's thumb on the scale.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#57

Post by Hexstream »

blasdel wrote: post #40
Hexstream wrote: post #16

"Well, they were probably a bit surprised, because they never thought about these things in these terms. But now I'm in touch with somebody who has converted one youth club to use free software, and he's now talking with the people who run the other youth clubs in his region, trying to convert them. So something's finally getting done." Notice the religious terminology. The Church of Emacs, eh. edit: Is it possible t…

No, you no can has bold . Italics are allowed because they allow you to annotate emphasis without making the text stand out more than normal -- you only notice it inline. Allowing bold would lead to asshats writing like Jeff Atwood.

I wouldn't mind if there was a limit (maybe as few as 3) on the number of words you can make bold. Or a percentage of your post, or something. Now that I think about it the same solution could be used to support blockquote (ex: max 2 blockquotes in a post + other restrictions). After all the argument against implementing it was that excessive use of quoting is often bad style.

I think it's pretty ridiculous not to support useful features just because 1% of people might misuse it.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#58

Post by jacoblyles »

kragen wrote: post #43
jacoblyles wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"I suspect that they had an equal chance of ending up like Thailand, or urban Malaysia, or other countries in the area; and it's not clear to me that aggressively persecuting Communists made a civil war less rather than more likely." The Thais and Maylays were with Singapore in taking aggressive anti-communist actions in the 1960s. None of the countries that escaped communism approached the Western liberal ideal of…

> "The Thais and Maylays were with Singapore in taking aggressive anti-communist actions in the 1960s. None of the countries that escaped communism approached the Western liberal ideal of political freedom." What do you think about the pre-civil-war human-rights records of Vietnam and Cambodia? Do you think they were more protective of political freedom before the wars than Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia? > "If I were…

One final point in response to your urban thesis: the difference in the standard of living in downtown Singapore and downtown Havanna.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#59

Post by jacoblyles »

forgottenpswrd wrote: post #49
kragen wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The last major expansion of the Eurasian gold supply was in the 1500s and 1600s, due to the looting of the Americas, and I think it roughly tripled the amount of gold in circulation. There has never been an event since the advent of gold-as-currency that multiplied by ten the amount of gold in circulation within a century, but that happens to almost every fiat currency almost every century. Predicting which decade it…

I am not so sure predicting when a fiat currency will be inflated is tricky. The money supply and interest rates being econ 101. And thinking of hyper inflation, where does that usually happen? Zimbabwe, Yugoslavia, the Weimar Republic - if a bad government wants to screw you, a gold backed currency won't save you. Does anyone think someone like Mugabe wouldn't just change the rules to do what ever he wants? Besides,…

Billions of dollars are won and lost on Wall Street everytime the Fed meets. If it were as easy as you say to predict the actions of the central bank, this would not be the case.

Re: Richard Stallman on his experience in Cuba

#60

Post by forgottenpswrd »

jacoblyles wrote: post #59
forgottenpswrd wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not so sure predicting when a fiat currency will be inflated is tricky. The money supply and interest rates being econ 101. And thinking of hyper inflation, where does that usually happen? Zimbabwe, Yugoslavia, the Weimar Republic - if a bad government wants to screw you, a gold backed currency won't save you. Does anyone think someone like Mugabe wouldn't just change the rules to do what ever he wants? Besides,…

Billions of dollars are won and lost on Wall Street everytime the Fed meets. If it were as easy as you say to predict the actions of the central bank, this would not be the case.

How many times to the daily fluctuations of wall street affect the rate of inflation or an average person's life?

I believe there's been at least one major stock market crash that has not led to a recession.

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