911–920 of 944 posts
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And this how one deflects an argument grounded in economic facts.
Yes yes, sure. Just be Putin's puppet dictator and you'll get free oil. There's nothing worth discussing here.
[0] https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.PCAP.PP.CD?locat...
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>Ehhh, because only MAGA complains No. Because Russia has specifically invested in propaganda efforts influencing rural voters in Poland to support Polish far-right parties (and PiS), using it to foster anti-EU and anti-Ukraine sentiment. The Polish farmers blocking the border checkpoints used for delivery of military aid to Ukraine a few years ago as "ptotest" was a mirror image tactic of the Canadian conservative t…
Today's news brings us the following headline:
"Fugitive former Polish Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro is now in the United States courtesy of a visa from President Donald Trump after fleeing Hungary, local media report."
Case closed, ladies and gentlemen and everyone in between.
https://www.politico.eu/article/ex-poland-justice-minister-z...
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this is Poland for you. everyone complains about everything. perhaps that's the secret to success - there's always something to complain about and one in a hundred (or thousand) people actually does something about it.
> this is Poland for you. everyone complains about everything That is western Europe for you, not just Poland. Same in the Netherlands, same in Sweden, same in Belgium, same in Denmark, same in Norway, same in France, same in Germany, etcetera. Descartes claimed that he thought, therefore he was. A more realistic and equally erudite quote would be Queror, ergo sum which translates to I complain, therefore I am . (als…
Sorry, no, you are missing the point.
The specific anti-EU complaining among the less-educated, older and rural population which benefits a lot from Poland being an EU state is not the same in Netherlands, Sweden, Belgium, Norway.
It is the same in Hungary and Slovakia though, for a reason.
Today's news brings us the following headline:
"Fugitive former Polish Justice Minister Zbigniew Ziobro is now in the United States courtesy of a visa from President Donald Trump after fleeing Hungary, local media report."[1]
In case it is not apparent to you, Ziobro was running on the PiS party ticket — the very same party running on the anti-EU sentiment that the people we're discussing have, in all certainty, voted for.
That's in the wake of another PiS-aligned fugitive judge, Tomasz Szmydt, fleeing investigation for espionage to find refuge in... Belarus[2].
Naturally, he condemned Poland for being too "pro-Western".
Swedish judges don't do that, while hiding in Belarus.
You don't have PiS in Sweden.
And Trump isn't welcoming fugitive Justice Ministers from Sweden into the US because they can't hide in Hungary anymore..
...because the Hungarian MAGA lost the elections there (in spite of JD Vance flying over to campaign for Orban, Orban giving speeches at CPAC, and Trump explicitly praising him).
Do you realize how off mark your objection to applying "the MAGA moniker" to PiS supporters is?
It's not even metaphorical; they're directly collaborating on a political level.
Have a good one, hope you learned something.
Skol.
[1] https://www.politico.eu/article/ex-poland-justice-minister-z...
[2] https://visegradinsight.eu/judge-hater-penitent-spy-the-stor...
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I wonder how many of those accounts are sock puppets like we have in American social media.
If you look at election outcomes you can see there are a lot of real ones, no need for sock puppets.
But sure, sock puppets also follow the crowd. Good money in it: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cj38m11218xo
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Why not? If the increase in cake size is bigger than the subsidies then it can be a net win, even for the people paying the subsidies. It also ignores the fact that absent the EU, countries would still have a lot of subsidies.
Because the total increase of the cake can mostly be transferred to those that receive the subsidies. It's not that hard to understand: if you redistribute 10% of total wealth from the top quartile to the bottom quartile for 1% in additional total growth, then even if that additional growth went completely to the top quartile, it would be a net -9% of total wealth for them. I don't say that's a bad thing per se. But…
Futhermore, what matter is the amount of tax collected by the EU. Energy subsidy is not money collected by the EU and distributed.
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Hm Finland, with the 38th highest suicide rate in the world? Well above the UK, in 117th place. I think you need our help :(
I was referring to how you have selected post-2008 government after another to completely tank the economy and destroy key British institutions, but Finland has a goverment that does exactly the same, so we do kinda need help as sell. Maybe we should go to some 12-step-program together. (PS. Finnish suicide rate has fallen through the 2000’s from 1200 per year to about 750)
Well we had a choice between 2 governments... Who are basically the same. Even if a radical government is elected in a couple of years, the deep state will essentially stop them from stepping outside the line which has already been chosen for us.
What I'm saying is that we, the British people, do not live in a democracy. So don't blame me :)
I live in Poland. This headline is misleading. Poland didn't build a top-20 economy. Western Europe and the US built their economy in Poland, because the labor is educated and cheap. There are almost no globally competitive Polish companies. The "growth" is branch offices of German and American corporations taking advantage of engineers who'll work for 40% of Berlin rates. Remove the foreign-owned sector and you're l…
That is how all economies grow. It is unnecessary to remove credit from Poland. You say labor is educated, for example. Is that also not their merit? Didnt USA benefit from mostly not being bombed during ww2? Didnt Germany benefit from cheap Russian gas and educated immigrants after 2008 crisis in EU? In the end, we can keep going back looking for pthers to thank but the country did it, and it is fair to say so. P.S.…
I don't think that's the case for us.
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>How can you honestly say that though. A blatant overgeneralization of a large group of people, but this has been a recurring theme on HN lately. Perhaps there is a miscommunication. What I meant to say is, I have not seen it mentioned a single time over many hours of arguing on HN about the US/Europe relationship. It's not an 'overgeneralization', simply an observation. >In the meantime, streets have been named afte…
The relationship is complex. Remember the Marshall Plan was needed partly because massive amounts of European infrastructure and industry which had occurred in some cases long before the USA even joined the war. The USA had the benefit of being resource rich, but also geographically isolated which meant that the continental USA never suffered from severe bombing raids or threats of invasion. (Many European towns and…
How does that change things? You could just as easily argue that Poland's economy was ruined by the USSR, therefore EU help is "complex".
Europe was an unfortunate spot, due to a war which started in Europe, and the US helped Europe defend against tyranny and rebuild. If the US hadn't helped Europe rebuild and defend itself, perhaps the USSR would've expanded all the way to the Atlantic.
Europeans have an annoying habit of taking US help for granted, and complaining about us endlessly. I'm tired of it. We should've taken the Swiss approach and allowed Europe to suffer the full consequences of European folly. That's what we do about poverty in Africa and South America. We don't regard that as our problem. Europe should not be our problem either.
Lord knows Europe wouldn't help the US rebuild if we suffered a devastating war. There was no European Marshall Plan after the US Civil War.
I never see Europeans complain about Swiss neutrality. The US should take the Swiss approach.
I live in Poland. This headline is misleading. Poland didn't build a top-20 economy. Western Europe and the US built their economy in Poland, because the labor is educated and cheap. There are almost no globally competitive Polish companies. The "growth" is branch offices of German and American corporations taking advantage of engineers who'll work for 40% of Berlin rates. Remove the foreign-owned sector and you're l…
That is how all economies grow. It is unnecessary to remove credit from Poland. You say labor is educated, for example. Is that also not their merit? Didnt USA benefit from mostly not being bombed during ww2? Didnt Germany benefit from cheap Russian gas and educated immigrants after 2008 crisis in EU? In the end, we can keep going back looking for pthers to thank but the country did it, and it is fair to say so. P.S.…
No it’s one way but there are many other ways. Look at the US, stating that they grew because China and the EU exported their industries there is simply false. But through technology advancements, market size, market leadership, etc… is closer to how they achieved their economic growth.