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France moves to break encrypted messaging

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Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#31

Post by wolvoleo »

heinrich5991 wrote: post #2

This article incorrectly implies that Telegram is end-to-end encrypted, by putting it in the same line as WhatsApp and Signal. Telegram doesn't even try to be end-to-end-encrypted by default. WhatsApp claims to be end-to-end-encrypted, but it's not open-source, Signal is end-to-end-encrypted.

Yes and the secret chats in telegram are super clumsy. Both parties need to be online at the same time for the key exchange, it only works on one device at each side. Nobody I know uses them.

I sent some people a password reset through them but half of them couldn't get their head around it.

So yeah while it has secret chats, they aren't very useful at all.

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#34

Post by Projectiboga »

2ndorderthought wrote: post #19
hellcow wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> WhatsApp claims to be end-to-end-encrypted, but it's not open-source And explicitly does not encrypt metadata. Meanwhile NSA top brass publicly stated, "We kill people based on metadata."

I imagine in 2027 people will be getting killed over vibes. Does make you wonder what kind of people they kill or how many. I can't think of a lot of crimes whose metadata warrants being killed for personally.

In the dystopian novel Nineteen Eighty-Four, thoughtcrime, also known as crimethink in the official language of Newspeak, is the offense of thinking in ways not approved by the ruling Ingsoc party. It describes the intellectual actions of a person who entertains and holds politically unacceptable thoughts; thus the government of The Party controls the speech, actions, and thoughts of the citizens of Oceania.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thoughtcrime

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#35

Post by nazcan »

I still don't understand the note that the companies can't decrypt the messages with e2e encryption. Isn't it as simple as a software update that says:

"If user = foo, then send the on device keys elsewhere"?

Or if those keys are part of a TPM, then a software update that just asks it to send in the decrypted messages?

Can judges not order this now, but can order decryption if the keys are stored centrally?

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#36

Post by tardedmeme »

userbinator wrote: post #15
palata wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The French people typically elect far-right politicians to represent them at the EU level, so...

It's not about left or right, but up and down.

Which are also known as right and left, respectively.

What, did you think right and left were arbitrary? The words are arbitrary, but the meanings are not. They correlate quite strongly with the material interests of the up and down.

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#37

Post by 2ndorderthought »

xethos wrote: post #30
2ndorderthought wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine in 2027 people will be getting killed over vibes. Does make you wonder what kind of people they kill or how many. I can't think of a lot of crimes whose metadata warrants being killed for personally.

> I can't think of a lot of crimes whose metadata warrants being killed for personally You're (literally) missing links then. If A is a high-value target that we look at closely (because they're a high-value target), what if B frequently contacts A? If C, D, and E always recieve messages from B immediately following A messaging B? What about times? Is B messaging F at a consistant time, and never outside of that? Is…

Thanks for explaining. I guess we are talking about espionage or something like that. I've been so focused on the rise of domestic surveillance lately that I forgot about the noncitizen aspects. Which is ridiculous but at the same time, it does seem like a trillion dollar focus lately.

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#38

Post by tensor »

HerbManic wrote: post #26
tensor wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These sorts of laws have repeatedly failed to pass in Europe due to people protesting. The government just keeps coming back and trying again it seems. What makes you think French citizens don’t care?

I do think they care but you hit on a point. Governments just keep trying to force this and eventually wear down the resistance to it. They can try repeatedly as it only has to work once.

Yeah, this feels like an exploit used by many governments these days. You see the same thing in the US where the Republicans just keep filing appeals or lawsuits until they eventually get what they want. Over and over and over and over.

Governments should probably adopt some sort of "retry" limit for these things. Good luck getting that passed though I suppose.

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#39

Post by 2ndorderthought »

Projectiboga wrote: post #34
2ndorderthought wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine in 2027 people will be getting killed over vibes. Does make you wonder what kind of people they kill or how many. I can't think of a lot of crimes whose metadata warrants being killed for personally.

In the dystopian novel Nineteen Eighty-Four, thoughtcrime, also known as crimethink in the official language of Newspeak, is the offense of thinking in ways not approved by the ruling Ingsoc party. It describes the intellectual actions of a person who entertains and holds politically unacceptable thoughts; thus the government of The Party controls the speech, actions, and thoughts of the citizens of Oceania. https://…

It's a great book! It does make you wonder what s future with neural link and data centers in every city looks like under a fascist regime.

Re: France moves to break encrypted messaging

#40

Post by novok »

HerbManic wrote: post #26
tensor wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These sorts of laws have repeatedly failed to pass in Europe due to people protesting. The government just keeps coming back and trying again it seems. What makes you think French citizens don’t care?

I do think they care but you hit on a point. Governments just keep trying to force this and eventually wear down the resistance to it. They can try repeatedly as it only has to work once.

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