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EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

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Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#41

Post by rufasterisco »

qnpnpmqppnp wrote: post #19

This title seems misleading. The EP paper appears to be highlighting the existence of a debate regarding VPN. Relevant quote: "Some argue that this is a loophole in the legislation that needs closing and call for age verification to be required for VPNs as well. In response, some VPN providers argue that they do not share information with third parties and state that their services are not intended for use by childre…

The title is also the exact title for that paper’s chapter.

You are right at pointing out that the paper is overall presenting the subject in a balanced manner, unfortunately it seems a bad choice was made when it came to that specific sentence, that gives a venue for it to be fed in the outrage machine.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/ATAG/2026/7826...

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#42

Post by lpcvoid »

pveierland wrote: post #38

Age restrictions + VPN bans + encryption restrictions + client-side monitoring + restricting general purpose computing.. It's just rapid descent into digital fascism set up by people who have no ability to see how the dots will end up connecting.

I think they absolutely have the ability to see it, it's part of the value proposition for them.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#43

Post by microtonal »

rdm_blackhole wrote: post #30

Here we go again with new restrictions on civil liberties. This is Chat Control all over again. The EU won't stop until it has access to all your data, all your messages, anything you read, save, send will be scrutinized by the the big great EU and it's little minions. Hey, at least we get the freedom of movement right?

There is no such thing as the EU wants X. There are huge differences between what the European Commission, the European Council, and the majority of the European Parliament want.

Most of the anti-privacy crap hasn't happened thanks to the EU. Particular countries and lobbying groups have been pushing this through the Commission and Council and most attempts have been rejected by the EP.

If we didn't have the EU, some countries would have long introduced this nonsense (like the UK). But in the EU that does not make much sense, since there is a single market, so you have to enforce it EU-wide.

The European Parliament + courts of justice/human rights are one of the last beacons of democracy/freedom worldwide that resist upcoming authoritarianism. We should support them and remind the Parliament over and over again that they should be continuing the good fight.

---

By the way, nearly all your comments on HN are about politics and all trying to sow dissent on Western (and especially European) democracies.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#45

Post by applfanboysbgon »

microtonal wrote: post #34
donmcronald wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All accounts and that are important to kids have are being tied to their real identity and they won’t be able to get a new one if they’re banned. The potential for social engineering is insane. All of these ID laws are going to make it more dangerous for kids online IMO. “Hi I’m a Roblox moderator. Your account was reported for X and you’ve been temp banned. Come to platform Y to appeal. Start by submitting all your…

First, I should say that I am against online age identification. But if we are going to get age verification because the larger population wants it, I definitely prefer the EU's privacy-preserving age verification that uses zero knowledge proofs (yes, they have issues too) over private companies doing age verification, requiring uploading scans of your ID, filming your face, etc. For the reasons that you mention (peo…

I think this is folly. You cannot communicate this level of nuance at scale, especially when faced with opposition that actively lies to achieve their goals.

Quoting an older post...

> In a benevolent dictatorship, sure, go for a zero-knowledge proof verification as your solution. In the reality of democracy, where politicians are corporate puppets who cloak surveillance laws in "think of the children" to rally support from the masses, we need to convince people to see through the lie and reject the proposals outright while reassuring them that they can protect the children themselves via parental controls. You will never be able to sufficiently inform 50.1% of the population of any country of what zero-knowledge proof even means, let alone convince them to support age verification laws but strictly conditional on ZKP requirements. That level of nuance is far too much to ask of millions of people who are not technically-informed, and idealism needs to give way to pragmatism if we wish to avoid the worst-case scenario.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#46

Post by xg15 »

thunderbong wrote: post #40

I have a question that's been going through my mind - Why is age verification connected with identity verification? I understand why the former is not possible with the latter, but my question is - Whichever entity is responsible for the verification can just pass on the age verification confirmation without passing through any of the other details, right? Am I mistaken here? Because if this was possible, I could sti…

This seems to be what "double-blind" verification is doing:

> The report highlights emerging approaches, such as “double-blind” verification systems used in France, where websites receive only confirmation that a user meets age requirements without learning the user's identity, while the verification provider does not see which websites the user visits.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#47

Post by xg15 »

nickff wrote: post #27
spwa4 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be replaced by the Irish tax department making direct deals that are essentially the same. But ONLY for specific companies (principle: big multinationals don't pay tax at all, local companies get big tax raises. Irish companies are dying, multinationals are moving to Ireland) https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/ireland/corporate/tax-credits-a... In case anyone wonders: this means the FANG companies don't pay tax in Irela…

Lots of governments give tax exemptions to selected industries (film comes to mind) or even companies (Foxconn/TSMC); I don’t support this behavior, but I don’t see what makes Ireland special in this regard.

Well, that was the original question of the thread:

> How come tax loopholes aren't as scrutinized?

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#48

Post by eloisant »

reddalo wrote: post #28
chii wrote: post #2

How come tax loopholes aren't as scrutinized? Mandatory age verification online is a blight imho. It should be outlawed.

I agree, age verification on the web should 100% banned. Parents should learn how to be parents; the government shouldn't force companies to do parenting instead.

Governement should force companies to give parental controls tools. Gaming companies like Nintendo and Steam do that, I can create a kid account with parental controls.

Social media companies (e.g. Meta, Snap) are the first that should provide that but they don't.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#49

Post by lifestyleguru »

JV00 wrote: post #16

Perhaps these legislators are addicted to porn and don't want their children to do to themselves the same they have done. Would explain their obsession and relentlessness to get this done. It's just a pity they are destroying the internet while doing that. They should be attacking the companies making money from porn instead. And by the way porn can damage your mind even after 18 so age verification is not a real sol…

I agree that age verification is old perverts addicted to porn simply projecting their problem onto others. Kids after a day of continuous swiping of tiktok and instagram want tattoos and bitcoin.

Re: EU Parliamentary Research Service calls VPNs "a loophole that needs closing"

#50

Post by dinwos »

thunderbong wrote: post #40

I have a question that's been going through my mind - Why is age verification connected with identity verification? I understand why the former is not possible with the latter, but my question is - Whichever entity is responsible for the verification can just pass on the age verification confirmation without passing through any of the other details, right? Am I mistaken here? Because if this was possible, I could sti…

It's a question of blind trust in your government to respect this, when they themselves control the age verification apps, at least in the EU who wants to impose its own system and not rely on an autonomous third party.
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