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Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

reuters.com

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Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#31

Post by tester756 »

01100011 wrote: post #16

> The Journal report said that the U.S. government, which became Intel's largest shareholder last year under a deal with its CEO Lip-Bu Tan, played a major role in bringing Apple to the negotiating table. Ah, so this wasn't a decision Apple freely made based on technical merits. Instead it sounds more like big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. My guess, Apple drags their feet for a couple years and ba…

>big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme.

What's wrong with US gov caring about supply chain and manufacturing capability of the most needed technology right there - on American soil?

It is in US' interest to be able to produce such complex tech locally

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#32

Post by boplicity »

tambourine_man wrote: post #20
torben-friis wrote: post #4

Wasn't the whole apple silicon thing about Intel being unable to keep up? Is this maybe a way to expand the affordable neo line?

Intel has been deemed a national security asset. Essential infrastructure. The government (both current and previous administrations) is doing everything it can to make sure they do keep up, at the very least. And with enough money being thrown at it, they probably will.

Also keep in mind that none of the big chip purchasers (Apple, Nvidia, etc), want to depend on one supplier for their chips. There are huge incentives among them to encourage Intel's success.

Nobody benefits if just one company controls the state of the art in chip manufacturing, and Intel is one of maybe two other companies positioned to have a chance at competing effectively with TSMC.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#33

Post by ahartmetz »

tester756 wrote: post #31
01100011 wrote: post #16

> The Journal report said that the U.S. government, which became Intel's largest shareholder last year under a deal with its CEO Lip-Bu Tan, played a major role in bringing Apple to the negotiating table. Ah, so this wasn't a decision Apple freely made based on technical merits. Instead it sounds more like big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. My guess, Apple drags their feet for a couple years and ba…

>big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. What's wrong with US gov caring about supply chain and manufacturing capability of the most needed technology right there - on American soil? It is in US' interest to be able to produce such complex tech locally

Yes, it's called industrial policy and it can work very well.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#34

Post by newsclues »

tester756 wrote: post #31
01100011 wrote: post #16

> The Journal report said that the U.S. government, which became Intel's largest shareholder last year under a deal with its CEO Lip-Bu Tan, played a major role in bringing Apple to the negotiating table. Ah, so this wasn't a decision Apple freely made based on technical merits. Instead it sounds more like big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. My guess, Apple drags their feet for a couple years and ba…

>big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. What's wrong with US gov caring about supply chain and manufacturing capability of the most needed technology right there - on American soil? It is in US' interest to be able to produce such complex tech locally

The issue for some is the driving force is military, to secure their supply chain to kill people.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#35

Post by saltcured »

wtallis wrote: post #30
saltcured wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many more economic cycles until Intel is asking Apple to fab Intel-designed chips?

Even if we make the not-particularly-reasonable assumption that Apple would want to own a fab, and the wildly unreasonable assumption that they would accept any outside customers for the fab: building a fab business from scratch to something competitive would take on the order of a decade or more even for a company with Apple's resources. And if Apple bought somebody else's fab business, it seems most likely that it…

Yes, I suppose I was imagining the weird transition like AMD did when they split off Global Foundries. Imagine the remaining Intel being a chip designer like AMD. For someone of my age, it seems both incomprehensible and somehow inevitable. Crazy leadership choices seem to be happening so often in recent years.

Honestly, I found it hard to understand why they abandoned RAM and solid state memory fab sectors too. With all the national security spending by DoD, DoE, etc., I would have thought there is room for some US-based business to remain, even if some of the mass consumer stuff has been lost to low margin international competitors.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#37

Post by shaboinkin »

newsclues wrote: post #34
tester756 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. What's wrong with US gov caring about supply chain and manufacturing capability of the most needed technology right there - on American soil? It is in US' interest to be able to produce such complex tech locally

The issue for some is the driving force is military, to secure their supply chain to kill people.

Counter point: Apple exists in their size because of the US’s willingness to keep shipping lanes and trade routes open by use of force and US diplomatic efforts to allow for trade to exist in foreign nations. It’s debatable if this still holds true or is the correct approach given the shitshow going on right now.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#38

Post by 9cb14c1ec0 »

whynotminot wrote: post #25

Big deal, smart for all parties, really. Apple standards will make Intel step up and become a better foundry partner. Apple will gain increasingly needed diversification. US supply chain gets a boost. Should be fine for TSMC in the short to medium term. Apple not going to risk actual mainline iPhone SoC on Intel any time soon, so lion share of TSMC Apple revenue will be fine.

> Apple not going to risk actual mainline iPhone SoC on Intel any time soon

Not to mention that Intel does not and will not any time in the next decade have the capacity for a product of that quantity.

Re: Apple, Intel have reached preliminary chip-making deal

#39

Post by saltcured »

01100011 wrote: post #16

> The Journal report said that the U.S. government, which became Intel's largest shareholder last year under a deal with its CEO Lip-Bu Tan, played a major role in bringing Apple to the negotiating table. Ah, so this wasn't a decision Apple freely made based on technical merits. Instead it sounds more like big government and a fancy stock manipulation scheme. My guess, Apple drags their feet for a couple years and ba…

This is more my imagining a book plot than any real insight, but...

This wouldn't be Apple's first rodeo with Intel. They know how prior partnerships soured. Could a sufficiently powerful shareholder, like the US government, help mitigate Apple's concerns about the outcome of a new partnership? I.e. that Intel would be pressured to honor certain strategic obligations, even if the leadership at Intel isn't so keen?

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