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Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

ecopv-eu.com

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Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#271

Post by spankibalt »

echoangle wrote: post #213
spankibalt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "If there’s no supply, it’s probably because the manufacturers [...] decided it’s not even worth it to offer that." You got it surrounded. Why offer devices that you have to support for a longer time (e. g. enterprise models) when there's more money to be made when you enshittify (which obviously goes beyond just batteries)?

Because you’ll be the only manufacturer making the desired product and have 100% of this market? If there are multiple manufacturers competing, surely one of them would do it if it’s profitable?

Yeah, sure, some of them already do. Their market share is practically negligible, enterprise players (e. g. Samsung with their Galaxy Xcover line) notwithstanding. That, on a strictly personal level, still doesn't mean they offer a desirable product.

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#272

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg »

john01dav wrote: post #193
chroma wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that people have different preferences, so the EU should not force people to buy phones with removable batteries. People who want such features can buy those phones, and people who want smaller, thinner phones can buy ones with integrated batteries. At most the EU should tax externalities like electronic waste, though that would be a rounding error compared to the cost of the phone itself.

Such phones with removable batteries are incredibly rare, such that finding one is quite likely to fail if you have any other concerns at all. If a truly well made phone was common and made by many people, then there'd be much less argument for this regulation.

What do you mean by "rare"? You just click "order". It's not like you have to go on the quest for the lost arc or anything like that. They are uncommon in the sense that people don't actually get them, but that's not because of a lack of availability. People do not want them.

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#273

Post by criddell »

SirMaster wrote: post #82
wmf wrote: post #7

There's an exception for batteries that "retain at least 80% of its original capacity after 1,000 charge cycles." Coincidentally, iPhones and probably other flagships already qualify for this exception.

Huh, my iPhones have never come close to this. They are always under 80% capacity before 1000 charge cycles.

My iPhone 13 Mini is almost 5 years old and well over 1000 charges and the battery health app reports 81% which I believe.

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#274

Post by protimewaster »

poisonborz wrote: post #187

Classic EU move, the last-minute 1000-cycle exemption undercuts the entire regulation.

The previous discussion of the bill on HN noted that the newest version of the bill is the one without the exemption. Is that incorrect?

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#275

Post by titzer »

manoDev wrote: post #243
elzbardico wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

External battery banks are a far superior solution now that almost everything has standardized on USB and we have power banks supporting high speed charging. They can be charged with the same power adapter you use to charge your phone, without the need of an extra docking thing. They can be used to charge any USB-chargeable device. They are not tied to your specific model, and thus you're not vendor locked with them,…

Lots of advantages, but one major downside: you can't pop the empty battery, put a new one and keep working. There's a reason professional devices (e.g. cameras) still have replaceable batteries.

I use a lot of rechargeable AAA and AA batteries. They have lower voltage than alkaline batteries (by design apparently), which is not normally an issue, but sometimes is a deal breaker. E.g. my thermostat did not like lower voltage AA batteries and shut down prematurely a number of times.

There's challenges adopting standardized rechargeable batteries, e.g. trying to recharge alkaline batteries risks fire/explosion (and you know that will happen far too often given the number of people out there), but if we have had standard battery sizes, voltages, and capacities for rechargeable batteries, things would be so much better.

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#276

Post by pfisch »

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #268
ratiolat wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IP68, replaceable battery, phone jack, 5G: https://m.gsmarena.com/samsung_galaxy_xcover6_pro-11600.php

I feel like the fact that the phone-with-removal-battery option already exists and is not popular in the market should be a signal to EU politicians about how much the public actually values this capability.

You can't buy an iphone with this functionality, and many people are locked into that walled garden for a lot of different reasons.

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#277

Post by bigbuppo »

Aurornis wrote: post #24

As others have mentioned this is for phones with batteries that can’t survive a reasonable number of cycles. That’s a reasonable exemption, in my opinion. I don’t want to pay the extra penalties of reduced structural rigidity and water tightness for a battery that I don’t need to replace for 3-4 years anyway. I do wish one manufacturer would make a flagship phone with replaceable battery so all of the uncompromising…

> I don’t want to pay the extra penalties of reduced structural rigidity and water tightness for a battery that I don’t need to replace for 3-4 years anyway.

What are you doing to your phone that needs all that? Using it as a hammer? Temporary support while building a tunnel?

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#278

Post by kjkjadksj »

jorams wrote: post #149
thewavelength wrote: post #20

I just called the shop to replace the perfectly fine e-Call battery in my soon four year old Hyundai car. 250€ to change a battery that has a ten year lifespan. I am not allowed to replace it on my own as it would invalidate the five year long guarantee provided by the manufacturer (not the one by law). Why is this stuff not considered as well? Also curious whether the "specialized devices" exemptions are AND require…

> I am not allowed to replace it on my own as it would invalidate the five year long guarantee provided by the manufacturer. Why is this stuff not considered as well? They're the ones paying for repairs, so it doesn't seem that unreasonable? That said: If you can prove the car is being maintained according to the manufacturer's specifications they can't require you to go to a brand dealership. That's just not necessa…

Recalls don’t require you to have had maintained the car at the dealership previousy

Re: Removable batteries in smartphones will be mandatory in the EU starting in 2027

#279

Post by protimewaster »

criddell wrote: post #256
protimewaster wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last time this was discussed, it was stated that the text exempting based on cycle counts was removed from the final, adopted version. Is that incorrect?

On the page linked to it mentions the two exceptions that exempt iPhone and other flagship phones - long lifespan (80% after 1000 charges) and waterproof (IP67). The other exemption criteria is for specialized (medical) devices and devices where a removable battery would be unsafe.

It does, but, in the previous HN discussion, there was a link to the what was reportedly the adopted version of the bill, and those exemptions were gone from the text.
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