Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Let's Buy Spirit Air

letsbuyspiritair.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

321–330 of 628 posts

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#321

Post by red_admiral »

gordon_freeman wrote: post #75
rapatel0 wrote: post #48

Fundamental problem: Flights don't make money. Airlines actually make all of their money through loyalty programs and credit card payments. They basically should have turned into regulated utilities long ago, but loyalty program revenue saved them. Unless this initiative will turn into a credit card company (which nobody likes or wants to do) it won't go anywhere Private equity will likely sell the company for parts.…

> "Flights don't make money. Airlines actually make all of their money through loyalty programs and credit card payments." If that's the case then how RyanAir survived and is thriving?

Bag fees and other ways to get passengers to pay above the headline price. Like this kind of thing: https://hallofshame.design/ryanair-when-every-page-is-a-dark... and https://darkpatterns.uxp2.com/pattern/ryanair-travel-insuran...

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#322

Post by paganel »

appreciatorBus wrote: post #112
striking wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the amount anyone would actually pay is substantially below cost for most routes, but it's still a service that many people depend on (either directly or by the indirect economic impact of travel). It's a genuine force multiplier that is unaffordable without being subsidized; making it a utility would just shift the subsidy from credit card points programs to the government.

If airlines didn’t exist, people and goods would continue to move around the globe as they have done for thousands of years. There’s nothing magical about air travel (or any other transport mode) that makes it worthy of subsidy .

> There’s nothing magical about air travel (or any other transport mode)

There kind of is. I can make it from here in Bucharest to Paris in about 3 hours by plane, while by car I'll need about 3 days (i.e. two sleepovers till I get there). This is magical to me. To say nothing of places like the Arabian peninsula or, I don't know, the Indian subcontinent, I wouldn't even think of getting there by car as it is close to impossible (at least when it comes to a land-route to India), but taking a plane is a 6-hour flight from nearby Istanbul to Delhi.

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#323

Post by anematode »

yolovoe wrote: post #283
oezi wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All loyalty programs are stupid. People waste their time on 1-2% savings. It is insane.

That's one free round trip international flight per year in a lot of cases. Plus sometimes other benefits like theft insurance, warranty extension, phone insurance, etc. You're subsidizing everyone else if you're not trying to get the best loyalty program.

> You're subsidizing everyone else if you're not trying to get the best loyalty program.

Quite the mentality...

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#324

Post by kakacik »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #233
tshaddox wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve flown Spirit and Frontier several times, and Southwest many times (I know they’re not quite in the same category, especially after their recent changes). I genuinely don’t know what you’re referring to regarding the experience being wildly different. Other than a few quirks about what they do and don’t charge for and how they board and assign seats, I feel like there’s almost no meaningful difference between the…

I feel like you're living in a different universe then. I will literally never fly Spirit (well, neither will anyone else) nor Frontier ever, I loath the experiences I've had on them so much. First, as someone with relatively long thighs, I literally don't fit in their sardine can seats. But more relevant to most people, while things may be OK if everything goes perfectly and nothing is delayed or cancelled, you are…

Sounds like you guys need some very basic regulations we have here in Europe - companies have to take care of folks, provide food, accommodation and replacement flights (and up to 600 euro in case of overbooking depending on distance). Not great, but worries like above are simply not on our calendar when traveling, low cost or not.

Also, here in Europe, traditional aircraft carriers have been migrating their quality towards bottom end (ie Swiss not giving any beers for free even on intercontinental flights, microscopic legroom also on intercontinental) while for example Easyjet is for me at this point a high quality reliable carrier with no bullshit. Ryanair is a dumpste3r but luckily they don't serve my nearest airport well.

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#326

Post by eru »

lostlogin wrote: post #304
eru wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

I know it’s frowned upon many circles, but regulation can work and do good. There is plenty of crap legislation and regulation about, but it doesn’t have to be that way.

Yes, but be careful not to commit the 'nirvana fallacy' of comparing real world circumstances against idealised optimal regulation.

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#327

Post by thrownthatway »

Symbiote wrote: post #300
thrownthatway wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> having to sit through three sales pitches instead of one I’m not from the US and have never flown any of the airlines being discussed here. I’ve never heard of this, is there some YouTube videos you can point me to.

I can't find videos. The cabin crew stand at the front of the plane, and either play a recording or make an announcement saying you can buy a lottery scratchcard for €2 or whatever, with some of the money going to charity. They then walk down the plane "scratchards? scratchcards?" They repeat this with a collection for charity (no scratchcard), a promoted drink, and some sort of food. I think this is mostly unique to…

Haha what! That’s wild.

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#329

Post by iSnow »

asvitkine wrote: post #186
AlexandrB wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, and this is exacerbated by how services like Google Flights work. There's little visibility into any kind of "quality" metric, but prices are always front and center. So why would you optimize based on anything else?

If the lowest prices cause insolvency for the company, then let your competitors go bankrupt to win in the long run?

I guess some of the legacy carriers are now drinking champagne since they got rid of one of the more aggressive ULCC competitors.

However, if you wait till your competition goes broke, you need to ensure you survive long enough and stay big enough so you don't get bought. That's not exactly easy.

Re: Let's Buy Spirit Air

#330

Post by MrBuddyCasino »

oezi wrote: post #299
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Isn't the state the expression of the people's will? Just recently HN discussed the „ban anonymity on the internet“ initiatives of various governments and who was behind it because nobody wants that. Certainly not the citizens.

The issue is that citizens issue ambiguous wills. They don't want kids to be able to look at porn, they don't want hate speech online, they don't want to be IDed online. Politicians try to square those competing wills.

This is not even remotely how most democracies work. Even California didn’t have a majority for gay marriage, yet it became law. Immigration is unpopular everywhere, yet politicians ignore voters wishes, often for decades.

The masses are mostly inert, elites and counter elites move the needle. Those who can manufacture consent win.

Post reply on HN