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DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

simonwillison.net

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Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#11

Post by rvz »

try-working wrote: post #10
KronisLV wrote: post #6

I'm currently paying for Anthropic's Max subscription (the 100 USD one) and I quite often hit or approach the 5 hour limits, but usually get to around 60-80% of the weekly limits before they reset (Opus 4.7 with high thinking for everything, unless CC decides to spawn sub-agents with Haiku or something). Those tokens are heavily subsidized, but DeepSeek's API pricing is looking really good. For example, with an agent…

Someone on Twitter got >200M tokens for around $10 at the current pricing level

So it begins.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#12

Post by caseyf7 »

teruakohatu wrote: post #4

The pelican is really getting old as an a standalone evaluation metric. By now they are certainly going to be in training set if not explicitly tuned to produce it for the press on HN alone. Keep the pelican but isn’t it time to add something else more novel that all current and past models struggle with?

It also seems like all of the models have converged on very similar images.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#14

Post by deaux »

I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. This might be explained by "well they're different people", but the difference is very stark for that to be the whole explanation.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#15

Post by pheggs »

deaux wrote: post #14

I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…

I am personally okay helping them as long as they publish the models and dont keep them closed. And I dont trust the settings where providers say they wont train on it.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#17

Post by cyber_kinetist »

holysantamaria wrote: post #16

From the pricing page of deepseek: (3) The deepseek-v4-pro model is currently offered at a 75% discount, extended until 2026/05/31 15:59 UTC. Was this taken into account when reviewing the model?

Yeah even the Chinese open models have a problem that inference costs for these aren't that cheap. The only way out for the AI bubble collapse is simply more efficient hardware at lower costs and infrastructure setup downtime.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#18

Post by prism56 »

deaux wrote: post #14

I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…

If the data is opensource on github, then in my opinion it should be fair game.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#19

Post by antiloper »

deaux wrote: post #14

I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…

AWS Bedrock has DeepSeek models running on their infrastructure. That should be enough to prevent training on user data (there's a markup compared to DeepSeek's pricing though).

And unfortunately AWS doesn't have prepaid billing, so you can't just give the internet access to your API key without getting FinDDoS'd.

Re: DeepSeek V4 – almost on the frontier

#20

Post by deaux »

antiloper wrote: post #19
deaux wrote: post #14

I'm surprised that people here don't care at all about these models openly training on your data, especially if you use them straight from the model developer. Whereas things like "GitHub now automatically opts everyone into using their code for model training" get hundreds of justifiably angry comments, I never see this brought up anymore on posts like these talking about using Chinese models through OpenRouter. Thi…

AWS Bedrock has DeepSeek models running on their infrastructure. That should be enough to prevent training on user data (there's a markup compared to DeepSeek's pricing though). And unfortunately AWS doesn't have prepaid billing, so you can't just give the internet access to your API key without getting FinDDoS'd.

The latest one available for serverless inference looks to be from 8 months (Deepseek v3.1), which is an eternity and far behind.
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