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Your phone is about to stop being yours

keepandroidopen.org

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Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#571

Post by tliltocatl »

rTX5CMRXIfFG wrote: post #479
jech wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m aware of alternate mainframe OSs but I’m not sure how common using one was. Extremely common at major universities and research centres. CTSS, ITS, TENEX, Multics, Unix and even VM/370 were all alternate operating at some point. > Other than OS2, alternate OSs for other systems were rather rare, You weren't there, were you? A lot of people replaced MS-DOS with DR-DOS before Microsoft deliberately broke it with…

> at major universities and research centres So not common outside of ivory towers, no?

Before IBM PC computer's weren't particularly commonplace outside of ivory towers either.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#572

Post by autoexec »

cromka wrote: post #416
encom wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>free You forgot to factor in the cost of a Mac.

You don't need a computer to develop Android apps?

You aren't even limited to android apps. You can install termux and write and compile your own code to run from there or to copy and run anywhere else.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#573

Post by danpalmer »

> "dismiss more scare screens"

This whole website is a scare screen. There's a lot that is not being said on this page, such as the advantages of the new system, and the motivations of the authors of this site.

There's a reasonable discussion to be had about trade-offs here, but this is entirely one sided, in somewhat bad faith in my personal opinion.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#574

Post by willi59549879 »

AkiraHsieh wrote: post #561

Android's original openness did attract users, but the flood of poorly-made apps also created real fraud and crime risks. Those of us on HN have high security standards, but for older users, that old policy created genuine security vulnerabilities. Just observing my own family members.

But how does this help? I guess most of the apps used for fraud were installed through the play store anyway

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#575

Post by virgildotcodes »

hellojesus wrote: post #543
aucisson_masque wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but where you were losing a lot, you're now losing only a little bit. And on the other side, the benefits of using iOS over Android spyware outweighs the cons now.

I haven't seen new data from celbrite in awhile, but I believe that grapheneos was the only truly secure phone from it for both bfu and afu as of a couple years ago. Apple lost my confidence after they removed Advanced Device Encryption for British users (plus implemented age verification for them). https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/14344-cellebrite-premium-ju...

I think it's been said that nobody has yet cracked Apple's Lockdown Mode, but that's likely not truly comparable?

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#576

Post by dpacmittal »

Anonyneko wrote: post #133

I've resigned to the fact that I'll need to use two phones, one with locked down Android/iOS for banking applications and government services (those require strong bank ID around these parts), another with some kind of a Linux or unlocked Android for literally everything else. Oh well, such is life, most people don't care enough about this to pressure Google/Apple/banks/governments into yielding. A big reason why a n…

Bank apps in India don't run on rooted phones, need developer mode and adb disabled. At the same time, their website works fine on Firefox on Linux where I can literally go through all their front-end source, attach and run debuggers.

What even is going on? Why are banks doing this security theatre when all their apps are doing is calling some backend apis?

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#577

Post by realusername »

danpalmer wrote: post #573

> "dismiss more scare screens" This whole website is a scare screen. There's a lot that is not being said on this page, such as the advantages of the new system, and the motivations of the authors of this site. There's a reasonable discussion to be had about trade-offs here, but this is entirely one sided, in somewhat bad faith in my personal opinion.

Sometimes reality is one sided, I personally see zero advantage to the new system.

And I don't see how this change adresses the number one source of scams, the Play Store.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#578

Post by autoexec »

catcowcostume wrote: post #505
anonymousiam wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my informed opinion, anybody who does banking on their phone is taking a big and unnecessary risk. I wish I could say more.

Not a choice if you live in a "developed" country

I live in a "developed" country and don't have a banking app on my phone. It's a choice. Sometimes it's a choice of which bank you bank with. Sometimes it's a choice to stick with more traditional means of interacting with that bank and not even checking your account using a website, but it's absolutely a choice.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#579

Post by StrangeSound »

danpalmer wrote: post #573

> "dismiss more scare screens" This whole website is a scare screen. There's a lot that is not being said on this page, such as the advantages of the new system, and the motivations of the authors of this site. There's a reasonable discussion to be had about trade-offs here, but this is entirely one sided, in somewhat bad faith in my personal opinion.

I agree. I don't like the idea of Android being locked down, but the conversations around this topic are tipping into disingenuous.

Your phone is still yours, you can still install third party apps, and you can still develop apps without a verification. But now there's a one-off hurdle to install them.

Not ideal, but when we think of the people that it's trying to protect, this feels like a reasonable middle ground.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#580

Post by raverbashing »

lucb1e wrote: post #330
raverbashing wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they have other motivations But for 1 person wanting to run their own software there are hundreds of people with the potential to install malware/crapware/etc

Had to read that sentence twice. You really think that there's more people getting scammed via "please tap the build number seven times and then go to extra settings and enable untrusted installs and then go to this website that I will dictate the URL of and you should ignore that install warning" etc etc etc. to install an apk to run software that can barely access more than a simple webpage could, than there are pe…

> You really think that there's more people getting scammed via "please tap the build number seven times

Yes, because this whole procedure is new

> Also note that "crapware" describes basically every app you find in google's store

Go back to emacs then I guess

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