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Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

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Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#101

Post by wood_spirit »

cooper_ganglia wrote: post #65
gambiting wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic(sounds like you are!) but indeed a lot of engineers left Russia after the war in Ukraine started as they didn't want to be drafted and didn't want to contribute to the war effort in some way, even if indirectly. Of course, many stayed or even willingly help. See how many engineers from Iran work abroad too, for moral and other reasons. The point is - this happens everywhere, it'…

[flagged]

Just curious, did the move on Greenland and Iran have national security interest? And is it economical or life threatening?

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#102

Post by Forgeties79 »

nradov wrote: post #91
_alternator_ wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct. It depends. For example, it might depend on what the collaboration is likely to result in. Perhaps it would be more likely to be moral there were some boundaries in place, like "no mass domestic surveillance" or "no fully autonomous weapons". Because the US government currently believes it is legal to blow up civilian drug traffickers and wage war without congressional approval. So at some point, yes, collab…

The US military has deployed fully autonomous weapons since at least 1979, and potential adversaries are now doing the same. For better or worse that ship has sailed.

So we are wrong to express any opposition or desire to maybe raise the bar here? Aren’t we supposed to be “the good guys”? Or should we just accept a role as the menace of the world, wildly throwing its weight around whenever we have an unscrupulous president?

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#103

Post by dmit »

ripvanwinkle wrote: post #90

One observation. Having your work being used by the govt in ways you disagree with feels similar to having your taxes used in ways you disagree. When you pay taxes you have no say in the bombs acquired with that and where they are dropped. The latter though doesn't seem to provoke the same push back

> When you pay taxes you have no say in the bombs acquired with that and where they are dropped.

Vote in elections, local and general.

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#104

Post by ripvanwinkle »

Barrin92 wrote: post #93
ripvanwinkle wrote: post #90

One observation. Having your work being used by the govt in ways you disagree with feels similar to having your taxes used in ways you disagree. When you pay taxes you have no say in the bombs acquired with that and where they are dropped. The latter though doesn't seem to provoke the same push back

you answered your own implicit question. You have a choice who you sell your work to, you don't have a choice what your taxes do. Seems pretty straight forward why the former elicits more push back. The government forces you to pay taxes it doesn't force you to build them tools of surveillance or weapons.

IF the feds are a sufficiently large market your viability as a business might depend on keeping them happy.

btw i am not making a judgement call on the ai usage issue itself, just saying that this and taxes are more equivalent than it might seem

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#105

Post by hashmap »

orochimaaru wrote: post #39
anematode wrote: post #28

Who could have seen this one coming. From yesterday: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/google-ai-pentagon-classified-u... ("Hundreds of Google workers urge CEO to refuse classified AI work with Pentagon"). Any AI researcher who continues to work here is morally compromised.

Why is it morally wrong for a US citizen to work with their government?

working to directly advance a product used substantially to oppress people via surveillance or war crimes, when you have many other choices, is immoral. easy.

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#106

Post by cooper_ganglia »

exe34 wrote: post #89
cooper_ganglia wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Don't attack law enforcement with a deadly weapon, whether it's a vehicle or gun. How do you attack law enforcement with a gun while on your knees, with your arms pinned behind you and the gun is holstered? It's interesting how we can watch the same video, and some people only see what they are told to see.

[flagged]

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#107

Post by griffzhowl »

cooper_ganglia wrote: post #65
gambiting wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic(sounds like you are!) but indeed a lot of engineers left Russia after the war in Ukraine started as they didn't want to be drafted and didn't want to contribute to the war effort in some way, even if indirectly. Of course, many stayed or even willingly help. See how many engineers from Iran work abroad too, for moral and other reasons. The point is - this happens everywhere, it'…

[flagged]

National security can mean protecting a society founded on the values of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

It can also mean facilitating a militaristic surveillance state.

Not necessarily the same things, and at some point we might have to choose who's side we're on

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#109

Post by titzer »

declan_roberts wrote: post #43
anematode wrote: post #28

Who could have seen this one coming. From yesterday: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/google-ai-pentagon-classified-u... ("Hundreds of Google workers urge CEO to refuse classified AI work with Pentagon"). Any AI researcher who continues to work here is morally compromised.

Thankfully Russia, China, etc have the same qualms as we do in the United States and will refused to send their brightest engineers to work on weapons so they don't become "morally compromised"!!!

I don't think the long-term game theory of race to the bottom works out quite how you think.

"Our enemies would have no qualms building a weapon that will end life on earth! We better build it first because we're the good guys!"

Re: Google and Pentagon reportedly agree on deal for 'any lawful' use of AI

#110

Post by jonathanstrange »

ceejayoz wrote: post #3

Who defines "lawful" if Google and the Pentagon disagree? > The classified deal apparently doesn’t allow Google to veto how the government will use its AI models. Seems concerning?

One thing is sure, they don't have international law in mind...
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