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Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

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Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#91
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Any monopoly with viable economics for profit with no threat of competition yields monopoly profits "With viable economics" is the point. My "ludicrous statement" is a back-of-the-envelope test for whether an industry is nonsense. For comparison, consolidating all of the Pets.com competitors in the late 1990s would not have yielded a profitable company.

Very convenient to leave out Amazon in your back of the envelope test, whose internal metrics were showing a path toward quasi-monopoly profits. Do you argue in good faith? There’s a difference between being too early vs being nonsense.

> Very convenient to leave out Amazon in your back of the envelope test, who’s internal metrics were showing a path toward quasi-monopoly profits

Not in the 1990s. The American e-commerce industry was structurally unprofitable prior to the dot-com crash, an event Amazon (and eBay) responded to by fundamentally changing their businesses. Amazon bet on fulfillment. eBay bet on payments. Both represented a vertical integration that illustrates the point–the original model didn't work.

> There’s a difference between being too early vs being nonsense

When answering the question "do the investments make sense," not really. You're losing your money either way.

The American AI industry appears to have "viable economics for profit" without AGI. That doesn't guarantee anyone will earn them. But it's not a meaningless conclusion. (Though I'd personally frame it as a hypothesis I'm leaning towards.)

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#92

It’s insane how they talk about AGI, like it was some scientifically qualifiable thing that is certain to happen any time now. When I have become the javelin Olympic Champion, I will buy a vegan ice cream to everyone with a HN account.

It sounds really similar to Uber pitch about how they are going to have monopoly as soon as they replace those pesky drivers with own fleet of self driving cars. That was supposed to be their competitive edge against other taxi apps. In the end they sold ATG at end of 2020 :D

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#93

It’s insane how they talk about AGI, like it was some scientifically qualifiable thing that is certain to happen any time now. When I have become the javelin Olympic Champion, I will buy a vegan ice cream to everyone with a HN account.

Any sufficiently complex LLM is indistinguishable from AGI

Some might be missing the reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clarke's_three_laws

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#94

It’s insane how they talk about AGI, like it was some scientifically qualifiable thing that is certain to happen any time now. When I have become the javelin Olympic Champion, I will buy a vegan ice cream to everyone with a HN account.

They redefined AGI to be an economical thing, so they can continue making up their stories. All that talk is really just business, no real science in the room there.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#95
post #13

This agreement feels so friendly towards OpenAI that it's not obvious to me why Microsoft accepted this. I guess Microsoft just realized that the previous agreement was kneecapping OpenAI so much that the investment was at risk, especially with serious competition now coming from Anthropic?

Microsoft is a major shareholder of OpenAI, they don't want their investment to go to 0. You don't just take a loss on a multiple-digit billion investment.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was actually really helpful. I feel like it should be done for all PR speak.

It's better than the original, but still off. "The Microsoft and OpenAI situation just got messy" is objectively wrong–it has been messy for months [1]. Nos. 1 through 3 are fine, though "if they can't keep up with the tech, OpenAI is moving out" parrots OpenAI's party line. No. 4 doesn't make sense–it starts out with "we" referring to OpenAI in the first person but ends by referring to them in the third person "they…

Being objectively correct isn't the goal of the translator, the translator can't possibly know if a statement is truthful. What the translator does is well... translate, specifically from some kind of corporate speak that is really difficult for many people including myself to understand, into something more familiar.

I don't expect the translation to take OpenAI's statements and make them truthful or to investigate their veracity, but I genuinely could not understand OpenAI's press release as they have worded it. The translation at least makes it easier to understand what OpenAI's view of the situation is.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#97
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They did not need to go so hard on the hype - Anthropic hasn’t in relative terms and is generating pretty comparable revenues at present OpenAI bet on consumers; Anthropic on enterprise. That will necessitate a louder marketing strategy for the former.

That’s funny. Why is it Altman is facing kill shots and Dario isn’t?

> Why is it Altman is facing kill shots and Dario isn’t?

Altman peaked in the zeiteist in 2023; Dario, much less prominently, in 2024 and now '26 [1]. I'd guess around this time next year, Dario will be as hated as Altman is today.

[1] https://trends.google.com/explore?q=altman%2C%20Dario&date=t...

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#98
post #33

It’s insane how they talk about AGI, like it was some scientifically qualifiable thing that is certain to happen any time now. When I have become the javelin Olympic Champion, I will buy a vegan ice cream to everyone with a HN account.

Do the investments make sense if AGI is not less than 10 years away?

The investments don't make sense.

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#99
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's better than the original, but still off. "The Microsoft and OpenAI situation just got messy" is objectively wrong–it has been messy for months [1]. Nos. 1 through 3 are fine, though "if they can't keep up with the tech, OpenAI is moving out" parrots OpenAI's party line. No. 4 doesn't make sense–it starts out with "we" referring to OpenAI in the first person but ends by referring to them in the third person "they…

Being objectively correct isn't the goal of the translator, the translator can't possibly know if a statement is truthful. What the translator does is well... translate, specifically from some kind of corporate speak that is really difficult for many people including myself to understand, into something more familiar. I don't expect the translation to take OpenAI's statements and make them truthful or to investigate…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft and OpenAI end their exclusive and revenue-sharing deal

#100
post #55
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, AGI is either here, or perpetually two years away, depending on your definition.

It's always been this way. I remember, speaking of Microsoft, when they came to my school around 2002 or so giving a talk on AI. They very confidently stated that AGI had already been "solved", we know exactly how to do it, only problem is the hardware. But they estimated that would come in about ten years...

I knew flappy bird was a bigger deal than it got credit for. Didn’t realize it was agi until just now.
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