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The Classic American Diner

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Re: The Classic American Diner

#51

Post by dylan604 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #49
plemer wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That may be the point. Simple inflation adjustment gives us x but the real price is more or less than x. Why is that?

> Simple inflation adjustment gives us x but the real price is more or less than x. Why is that? Restaurant economics are a function of ingredient costs and labour. I suspect ingredient costs are close to OP's estimated multiples. But real wages are way up since the 1950s. Anything with a large labour component of costs will have tended to rise faster than inflation, which is an average of goods and services. (There…

Are you saying the prices listed were just for the ingredients and not the actual cost to the person ordering? They mentioned they saw the price in a photo which suggest it is what the person would be charged. I get that labor costs would cause an increase of raw ingredient price comparisons for total prices. But if you could pay buy a burger for a nickel but now need $10, there is a definite issue in just a "simple" adjustment that suggests you'd only need $5. If the numbers are that far off because the simple needs to be more advanced, what's the point of the simple numbers? Bad data is worse than no data.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#52

Post by gyomu »

dylan604 wrote: post #44
hackingonempty wrote: post #22

One of my hobbies is looking up old prices in the BLS CPI calculator to see what they would cost today (March 2026 is the latest data.) The June 1940 photograph along Hwy 1 in Maryland had $0.05 hotdogs ($1.17) and $0.10 burgers ($2.34). The Feb 1959 photograph from the NYC diner advertises a $0.45 burger ($5.14) and probably a $0.75 steak sandwich ($8.57)

These prices adjusted for today's value seem off though. I'm guessing you'd be hard pressed to find a diner burger for $5.14 anywhere. No, fast food joints are not the same here and not part of this discussion. Where is the discrepancy? I've never really trusted these "adjusted for inflation" type numbers. I'm not an economist so I have no idea how they are calculated, but they've always just felt off to me. Usually,…

Things just don’t really convert neatly because the shape of what people spend money on in life hasn’t evolved uniformly.

Food appears somewhat cheaper, housing much cheaper; but clothing and tools/appliances were much more expensive. Things like student debt and healthcare costs are also interesting to compare and wildly differ over time & place.

Also common for the average middle class person to spend a sizable percentage of their income on travel/vacation today; as I understand it that was quite uncommon before the mid 20th century.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#53

Post by bdunks »

dylan604 wrote: post #44
hackingonempty wrote: post #22

One of my hobbies is looking up old prices in the BLS CPI calculator to see what they would cost today (March 2026 is the latest data.) The June 1940 photograph along Hwy 1 in Maryland had $0.05 hotdogs ($1.17) and $0.10 burgers ($2.34). The Feb 1959 photograph from the NYC diner advertises a $0.45 burger ($5.14) and probably a $0.75 steak sandwich ($8.57)

These prices adjusted for today's value seem off though. I'm guessing you'd be hard pressed to find a diner burger for $5.14 anywhere. No, fast food joints are not the same here and not part of this discussion. Where is the discrepancy? I've never really trusted these "adjusted for inflation" type numbers. I'm not an economist so I have no idea how they are calculated, but they've always just felt off to me. Usually,…

The Market Basket used to calculate the BLS CPI changes over time, which can make long range comparisons difficult.

I’ve read of political influence on the market basket to lower the reported rate of inflation by the incumbent party, but I’m not educated enough on the topic to give an opinion on if it happens.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#54

Post by vkou »

plemer wrote: post #45
dylan604 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These prices adjusted for today's value seem off though. I'm guessing you'd be hard pressed to find a diner burger for $5.14 anywhere. No, fast food joints are not the same here and not part of this discussion. Where is the discrepancy? I've never really trusted these "adjusted for inflation" type numbers. I'm not an economist so I have no idea how they are calculated, but they've always just felt off to me. Usually,…

That may be the point. Simple inflation adjustment gives us x but the real price is more or less than x. Why is that?

Inflation is a measure of change in overall purchasing power.

What a specific purchase costs is highly dependant on the inputs, the cost of its labour (which might grow faster or slower than the average wage), and a lot of other factors.

Food is way more expensive today than it was 50 years ago. Airplane tickets are way cheaper. Everyone has a cellphone now, and middle class families have multiple cars, but a trip to the doctor will mean that ~15% of the population will be on the verge of not paying their bills. On the other hand, I have access to ~every major piece of music ever made for ~$15/month, so that's something.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#55

Post by xeromal »

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #28
thaumasiotes wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place. What do they serve?

Burgers, shakes, pancakes, hot dogs, sometimes BLTs and tuna melts. That sort of thing. In Europe, the "American Diner" is usually the only place that'll serve a normal plate of pancakes. (Everywhere else it's crepes, which are completely different...)

Do they serve hashbrowns?

Re: The Classic American Diner

#56

Post by xeromal »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #38
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Burgers, shakes, pancakes, hot dogs, sometimes BLTs and tuna melts. That sort of thing. In Europe, the "American Diner" is usually the only place that'll serve a normal plate of pancakes. (Everywhere else it's crepes, which are completely different...)

Sounds pretty reasonable. Within the US, there are at least two major diner chains: https://www.dennys.com/ https://www.ihop.com/en At a diner in America, I'd be unsurprised to see some less "diner" offerings. When I go to my local non-chain diner, I order fettucine alfredo. And the article here has a good picture of a diner advertising "American and Korean food". I think part of the core diner concept is a somewhat…

I'd say a waffle house is a better chain if you're in the lower Southeast. Much closer to a true diner experience

Re: The Classic American Diner

#57

Post by armadsen »

MrDrMcCoy wrote: post #33
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like they have them in Helsinki: > https://maps.app.goo.gl/NCiZgiRjGckp6Jzn6 And if that doesn't appeal, there's another one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/e3ZWtXWEKPvDnded8 Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place. From Belgrade,…

Fun to see all that, but curious why I haven't seen any on any of my trips across the UK and Ireland. I even asked some locals and they did not know of any diners anywhere in the country. I would've thought they would've been all over it.

Eddie Rocket's is an Irish chain of American diners. I've eaten there in Dublin. Although at least that location is downtown, and in a bigger building, not a classic diner style building. The inside is very much American Diner themed with vinyl seats, chrome, jukebox controls at the table, and of course the menu of burgers, fries, shakes, etc.

https://www.eddierockets.ie

Re: The Classic American Diner

#58

Post by pimeys »

chrisco255 wrote: post #27
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like they have them in Helsinki: > https://maps.app.goo.gl/NCiZgiRjGckp6Jzn6 And if that doesn't appeal, there's another one: https://maps.app.goo.gl/e3ZWtXWEKPvDnded8 Something you've got to realize is that this form of culture is something that has gone far beyond America's borders. To the European, it is the very pinnacle of "American Food" -- and 50s/60s themed diners are all over the place. From Belgrade,…

Your first link is a restaurant in a shopping mall. It has the interior facade of being a diner, and it serves...avocado bites, spicy chicken nachos, kimchi burgers, etc. Not really the same! Vegas has an eiffel tower too...

I was born in Finland and 100% agree.

Diners are something else. In Germany we have "American diners" where you pay for each cup of coffee.

It's not the same.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#59

Post by A_D_E_P_T »

xeromal wrote: post #55
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Burgers, shakes, pancakes, hot dogs, sometimes BLTs and tuna melts. That sort of thing. In Europe, the "American Diner" is usually the only place that'll serve a normal plate of pancakes. (Everywhere else it's crepes, which are completely different...)

Do they serve hashbrowns?

Yes, in fact. I was at the one in Belgrade about a year ago, and their hashbrowns are terrific. It's mostly a burger and pancake joint, though.

Re: The Classic American Diner

#60

Post by mc32 »

joecool1029 wrote: post #43

NJ got snubbed in this submission. We still have tons of independent diners (around 450 according to this article: https://www.npr.org/2024/04/01/1241959475/new-jersey-diners-... )

Yeah, it's weird, NJ is pretty well-known for having iconic Diners. People from many different states will know about NJ diners.

https://www.tastingtable.com/1203923/best-diners-in-new-jers...

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